What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And Ammo

Susie Harrison
By Susie Harrison November 9, 2020 08:57

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And Ammo

I always grew up in a house with a gun in it. As I ventured into adulthood, there were times I joined the boys at the desert shooting range; but only to get the basics. I am a bit of an amateur here but guessing some others might be as well. Join my journey to my online shopping and local Big R to find other weapons to add to my one and only 22.

Here’s my thoughts, some will agree and disagree; If rioters end up on my street and start breaking in houses, hurting people, and stealing things… I want to defend my home and children. One 22 might not be enough. To me, even if we have enough ‘look a likes’ that each older son is carrying around our yard from different angles, it might look fierce enough to discourage any vandals from my home.

We do need something efficient that will do some damage if an enemy runs up on us with a knife, bat, or fist… even a gun. All the gun stores are on back order in our state. We do have open carry and limited laws in owning guns, so that is a plus.

Related: How To Prepare Your House Against Looters

I began searching online. At first, I purchased another cheap Crossman with Co2 cartridge and a frightening looking Crossman Co2 Air Rifle.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoI am not bashing on Crossman, but these were failures for me.

The little pistol worked as badly as the ones before I got my boys in the past. The air of the Co2 leaks out while installing, leaving the copper pellets to fall right out the front after loading.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoAnd while the Crossman Rifle Air Gun at 60$ looks frightening… you got to pump that baby up 10 times to get one shot.

If you aim right it will do damage… but in a suddenly violent situation, it just will not work fast enough. Too boot, any dangerous character will see you pumping and know it is a harmless BB gun.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And Ammo

Not recommended, unless they are just for show.

I upped my game. I went to Youtube and Amazon and found many Air Rifles that actually kill bore! That would equal a gun in self defense. Sadly, after all my other prepping I couldn’t afford these high powered air rifles and had to pass. If you have the money for a gun, but can’t find one, I highly suggest you look these up… starting about 300$ you can find some decent ones.

Then I remembered Big R down the street. I tend to find things much cheaper there. The Ammo and Guns are all sold out. I waited for help and headed to the Air Rifle department. I wanted a pistol for me. I’m smaller and it’s easier for me to handle. I love shooting them, less complicated.

I saw the Crossman and knew it wasn’t for us, but next to that was a Daisy 21 Shot Powerline 415 Semi-Auto Air pistol. Hesitant it would be like the little Crossman, the clerk said they were very effective.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoBoy, was he right. I got that little puppy home and it not only sounded like the real thing, but was sharp like a razor. The Co2 went into the pistol without a sound, I loaded the 21 copper BB’s and headed out to my backyard.

I have a very thick plastic lawn chair that most bb’s won’t penetrate. And if anything does go through it, I know it will go through skin, perhaps lodge in a bone. Not that I really want it to kill anyone, but if SHTF, you have to do what you have to do.

It was amazing, the 415 Auto-air pistol was spot on, sounded like the real thing so much I thought someone might call the police (they never did).

I shot all my 21 rounds very quickly with decent aim. I tore that ½ of an inch hard plastic like no ones business. I had such a good time, I used up another cartridge and several hundreds of pellets before retiring.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoIf anyone were running at myself or my boys who had this air pistol, it wouldn’t just slow them down, it would cause damage. The closer the better.

I immediately went back to Big R and bought one more.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoThen I saw THIS:

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoThis would be the most affordable next best thing to a bore killing Air Rifle. Please click the link below for the gun over-view and interview with the Big R associate:

In addition to powerful Air Pistols and Rifles that use Co2 for power instead of pump, there are some other things that are helpful. When my daughter worked at a gun store in another town she gave us high powered sling shots for Christmas. Just a few practice shots and the accuracy is above par.

There are steel pellets, white marbles, regular marbles, and you can even use jagged rocks. This doesn’t have the speed coming against on oncoming predator, but used with a real gun, powerful air rifles, Sumari swords (one of my son’s owns)… you’re family could be a force to be reckonned with.

What To Do When Stores Run Out Of Guns And AmmoOther articles here will best address where to put your guns when the time comes. Or whether you make a show of force or not. I believe it depends on the situation. If 5 members of my family all have a rifle sling on their back and even if the bb rifles in the sling look real from a distance, while holding air pistols that effectively shoot and cause damage… it may be intimidating enough to hold off a small un-gunned mob. There are times weapons shouldn’t be shown as well.

Some may be critical of this article, and there are those with more experience, however this was my journey. And after all the point is to use what you can get and what you have to protect your family if S does HTF.

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Firearms for Emergency and SHTF Situations

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Susie Harrison
By Susie Harrison November 9, 2020 08:57
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76 Comments

  1. Redlist Renegade November 9, 15:46

    What to “DO” ? SHIT (If You’re NOT Already Prepared) !!!

    Reply to this comment
    • Dave from San Antonio November 9, 21:00

      Prepping can still be done, even if you are not prepared, yet. I’ve been prepping for years and took it slow, easy and weighed my choices on what I was buying. Firearms and ammunition were at the top. Those are not usually at the top of the ‘prepper’ chain for preparation, but the political game has changed so much in the past 12 years, I made it a ‘first’ consideration. After that, I concentrated more on the basics such as food, water, first aid, power supply, etc. I’ve tried to be as frugal as I can, but with certain things you get what you pay for. I’ve got a small library of books and ‘How to’ information that covers a lot of things. These are not digital, but ‘hard copy’. I have, also, almost all of it on thumb-drives, too. Am I ‘prepared’ for everything? No, but I am ‘ready’ for just about anything. To those who have ‘not’ prepared, yet…start. Don’t go ‘hog wild’ on it. Just set reasonable goals and go from there. Do your research for what you might need…in ‘your’ neck of the woods. Do ‘not’ get caught up in the “What if” game, as you will start spinning your wheels and go nowhere.

      Reply to this comment
    • Tarheel November 9, 21:50

      David took out Goliath with a sling but I’m not that optimistic of my skills. You can always put someone’s eye out with a rubber band gun.

      Reply to this comment
      • Raven tactical November 12, 23:32

        David was a slinger. Which at the time was considered one of the most lethal weapons of that time.

        Reply to this comment
        • left coast chuck November 14, 03:30

          Yes, the Roman Army had a corps of slingers. The lead slug they slung was called a ballista and it was deadly. That was the whole purpose of the exercise.

          It can be used for offensive purposes but it takes practice in order to be able to make it a deadly device.

          I checked Amazon and you can buy them from Dave the Sheepherder (I think that is what he calls himself) for $14.00. He makes them out of paracord. They are 60 inches long. There is another vendor besides Dave who has slings and they too are 60 inches long. That must be the magic number if you are into sling making.

          Reply to this comment
  2. Rick November 9, 16:13

    Stocked up when Obummer was in office. Guns,ammo,knifes,reloading supplies,and survival gear.Toped off when Clinton ran.Plus added food and water.

    Reply to this comment
  3. Juggles grenades November 9, 16:28

    Back when Barrack Obama was president, we thought he would come after the guns. So we sold all of ours, and bought Spears, shields and short swords. Now we fight like the “unsullied” on Game of Thrones.

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  4. Marc November 9, 17:38

    Sorry, but I couldn’t get past the first several sentences.

    If you’re counting on “bluffin'” your way to home security, I’ll just go ahead and tell ya some truth here . . . you’re a dead man. Your kids are dead. Your wife and any friends that are there, are dead.

    Should true “SHTF” type activities start popping up, appearances & subterfuge will likely cost you your life.

    Understand that I’m on your side here. I’ll most likely take a beating on this thread and flamed back to the stone age. It wont matter though, as after the “SHTF” dust settles, I may be one of just a few to read it.
    Your survival will rely on cold, hard, facts & reality. Not BB guns and sayin’ “BOO”.
    May God Bless You !

    Marc ;o)

    Ps. No, I didn’t read the entire article. Couldn’t take it.

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    • City Chick November 10, 15:45

      Marc – Well put! We are like minded here.

      Reply to this comment
      • Susie Harrison November 11, 03:30

        We DO have real guns and plenty of ammo for those, but not enough guns for everyone in the family. We started shopping for a 9mm pistol for me and a semi-auto rifle for my son months ago. The guns were all sold out in our area. I’m a girl, but doing something is better than nothing. Most of our neighbors don’t have anything.

        Reply to this comment
        • red November 11, 11:02

          Susie: I like the article and agree. I’ve seen BB guns do serious close-up damage and they’re better than nothing. I came back to Arizona a few years ago and while I could have bought a less expensive place only 20 miles away with more land, it was Pima County, and those creepy politicians sell out for a song. There are too many complainers and fault-finders here. We’re all frustrated with what’s going on across the nation and it’s showing in too many posts. Peace. Remember the old saying, like gas, this too shall pass. walk in His beauty

          Reply to this comment
    • jl in utah November 10, 23:59

      you really should have cause this was info should you NOT be able to get gun or ammo and some things to consider, no did jot say to use a bb gun, But told us why that would not work. for someone who is new at this prepping, and unable to get gun/ammo some of the pointers were good

      Reply to this comment
    • Susie Harrison November 11, 03:29

      We DO have real guns and plenty of ammo for those, but not enough guns for everyone in the family. We started shopping for a 9mm pistol for me and a semi-auto rifle for my son months ago. The guns were all sold out in our area. I’m a girl, but doing something is better than nothing. Most of our neighbors don’t have anything.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck November 11, 05:05

        Susie: If your state does not require all gun sales to go through a gun dealer, it is time to get creative in your shopping. Instead of gun stores, check pawn shops. With lots of folks unemployed due to the charade put on by the iintelligentsia, pawn shops may well have a firearm that suits your purpose and pocketbook. Another source is to look in the sporting goods section of the classified ads in your newspaper and the third source I would suggest is to visit garage sales. Back before it was illegal to sell a gun without going through a gun dealer in the PDRK several of my fellow shootists regularly scouted garage sales on the weekends looking for guns that the homeowner felt he no longer needed or wanted.

        It takes time time and some legwork, but it may turn up something. Also if you let pawnshop owners know that you are in the market for a certain or just plain guns they may let you know when they get a gun either out of pawn or that they just buy outright knowing that they can sell the gun for more than the guy letting it go for quick cash.

        While you might be tempted to advertise in the sporting goods section of the classifieds that you are looking for a certain brand/model firearm, I would advise against that course of action as it is fraught with alligators. Gun by-backs (so-called) are notorious for having hot guns dumped there with no questions asked. Criminals who have a gun that they know is really hot because it has been used in several shootings/murders that nobody will touch because the criminals he runs with all know it is hot, will get dumped at buy-backs where the criminal gets rid of his gun that every law enforcement in the state is looking for with no questions asked AND he gets a cash card for Target or some other store with snowflake management.

        If you buy a gun and it is stolen and is on the stolen list of guns and you should somehow let law enforcement get hold of it, you will lose it and not get any compensation. Also, you really don’t want to buy a hot gun. You will be dealing with criminals and there really is no honor among criminals despite urban legends to the contrary. And it has the strong possibility of being a hold-up using the gun that you thought you were going to buy. The crook knows how much cash you are bringing with you.

        Good luck. I really hope that you can get the real protection that you seek. Try to be an informed consumer and learn something about what you are attempting to do. It will save money and pain.

        Reply to this comment
        • red November 11, 11:27

          LCC: Hot guns are a hot item in the underground. The superstitious see them as lucky; other see them as a means to blame someone else for a crime. If you want a ‘lucky’ gun it’ll cost you. It’s the same with Japanese swords. The more wars it’s been thru, the stronger the ‘spirit’ is. niio

          Reply to this comment
    • Jackson November 11, 04:45

      Yes, I agree. When studying the Bosnia crisis. Plus listening to and reading other people that have actually went through it. You better have real guns and ammo. Plus all the other prepping supplies. In addition a team/family with many helping. Yes, night vision/thermal helps. Since you can not move around outside in the day time. Without risking life.

      Reply to this comment
  5. iampro2a November 9, 17:56

    The use of CO2 air guns can be an option in some scenarios. They can prove to be fatal with proper training and shot placement. While a firearm is preferable, an air gun should not be discounted.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 10, 18:33

      If you are talking about a pcp airgun, yes, I would agree with you, in calibers from .25 on up to .50 caliber. If you are talking about the cheap CO2 guns that sell for around $100 or less, I’m sorry, but without a concrete example, I would say you are dead wrong and should you attempt self-defense against an armed opponent, armed with almost any kind of weapon from a billy club on up not only will you be dead wrong, you will also be dead.

      If you believe you are correct, please post the specifications for such a wonder weapon. I have posted the specs for the toys this poor woman bought and what I consider to be reasonable alternatives. The air javelin that I posted is a CO2 gun but in an EOTW situation, CO2 cartridges are going to disappear rapidly. While it might dispose of a solitary opponent and if multiple units were engaged properly, might even handle a limited group of such individuals, there is a good reason why firearms, even muzzle loaders rapidly replaced crossbows in warfare.

      Reply to this comment
  6. Dave from San Antonio November 9, 18:11

    I guess airguns, whether pump, spring powered or CO2 would be better than nothing. They ‘do’ make airguns that can kill a boar, but most of those cost much more than $300. These are the ‘PCP’ line of airguns. Most of those also take a special pump to bring them up to power and that can add a few hundred dollars to your cost. These come in calibers from .22 to .50, so figure in the cost of the ammo. I would have more confidence in a good bow or crossbow. Again, expect to pay over $250 for a decent one. Again, there is the cost of the arrows or bolts to think about. There ‘are’ good and inexpensive firearms that you can still find, but ammo will be the problem, especially for the more popular and common ammo types. Reloading is a good option, if you want to go that route, but if you do…make damn sure to get a good reloading book and ‘never’ try reloading without one. Too much powder and ‘boom’. Too little powder and ‘pop’…you’ll be trying to get the bullet out of the barrel. To start, use a good single-stage press as they are easy to use. Slow, but easy. As with anything, though, the startup costs will seem high.

    Reply to this comment
  7. Dan Crocker November 9, 18:49

    Our local store’s firearms counter is almost bereft of guns. This always happens during a presidential election, specially if Democrats seize power. Ammo supplies are scarce as well. I am seeing prices of over a dollar a round for .223. Those with foresight already knew this was coming and stocked up accordingly .

    Reply to this comment
  8. Arthur November 9, 18:52

    I follow and read your posts but have never commented, …….but this one. Wooo Boy. I thought you were a prepper, meaning that you prepped. You should have had these thoughts years ago, especially before everybody else who was late started to purchase guns and ammo.

    As someone who has a very long history with and understands firearms, I find your current thoughts disturbing and dangerous. If you confront a gun toting intruder who has a small inkling of what he is doing with one of your recommended gun options, you are in severe trouble. Even worse is if their intent is already to harm you, and you “show” or shoot a gun replica you are probably going to be shot. This was a terrible post.

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    • Labienus November 11, 03:29

      I agree. Sorry but if someone means to hurt you and your family, and you pull this shit, you’ll only piss them off. You don’t want to be effectively defenseless with a pissed off intruder(s). They may take their time now.

      Reply to this comment
  9. MikeyW November 9, 19:11

    What is a “bore killing” air gun? Please tell us what the fps rating is on the Daisy 415 and others you are recommending.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 9, 23:05

      She actually meant boar, meaning wild hawg. A .357 pcp air rifle will kill a hog as will the .45 and .50 caliber air rifles. However, be prepared to pay as much for one of those as you would a nice .308 or thereabouts rifle, over $1,000.

      Reply to this comment
  10. left coast chuck November 9, 19:29

    Wow! There is so much wrong with this article I hardly know where to begin.

    First of all, thinking that the sight of a firearm will scare off someone who is bent on violent crime is totally incorrect thinking. I submitted an article to Claude a couple of weeks ago outlining the local District Attorney’s report on a police shooting. He hasn’t seen fit to publish yet, but I would urge him to do so to put to rest the urban legend that just showing a gun will drive someone away. If you think it would make interesting reading tell him so. He is supposed to read all the posts. If he gets enough requests I think he will publish it.

    Don’t take my word for it, just ask any patrol cop who has been on patrol more than a year how many times someone he or she has tried to arrest and where they found it necessary to draw their side arm the perp offered to and perhaps even attempted to insert it in one of the officer’s body orifices.

    Secondly, while I hardly consider myself an expert in air rifles and pistols, I certainly have a tad more knowledge than this lady, so it is time for an introductory course in air guns.

    BB pistols and rifles, whether by cocking mechanism or by CO2 cartridge are old school. While there are some fine 177 and .22 gas piston and spring piston air rifles in the market place, the most powerful air rifles, one capable of taking down medium sized game and that includes two-legged varmints, are pre-charged pneumatics abbreviated pcp air guns.

    Umarex is a company that is turning the air gun market place upside down with their high powered, relatively low cost air rifles. Right now I am looking at an ad for the Umarex Origin .22. It is a pcp that can be charged with a hand pump and if I understand the copy in the ad, the hand pump is included in the price of the gun.

    Some sample specs on the Origin are .22 caliber; 100 pumps will charge the rifle for 40 shots. It comes with 10 round magazines. its muzzle velocity is 1076 feet per second, a velocity that approaches the velocity of a .22 long rifle fired from a 24 inch barrel .22 rifle. Admittedly, that velocity is with a light weight pellet, not a standard lead pellet, however, I suspect that the muzzle velocity with a standard weight lead pellet will be in the vicinity of 900 feet per second, still a potentially lethal velocity. The cost on the Pyramid Air website is $350.00. Admittedly that is more than the Crossman single shot .177 caliber air pistol and even the slightly more CO2 lookalikes that fire 177 pellets. You can buy a CO2 gun made by Sig Sauer that has the same feel, weight and looks identical to their P226. It even has recoil action to simulate the action of the P226. That is a gun that would fool anyone but the most sophisticated, knowledgable shootist as to its authenticity as a 9 mm handgun. BUT it is still a bb gun and when push comes to shove, it won’t do the job of a P226 in 9mm.

    By comparison, the Daisy Powerline 415 that the authoress bought has a muzzle velocity of 500 fps. It has fixed sights and reviewers report that the trigger pull is heavy and erratic leading to poor accuracy. The sights are fixed which means that they can’t be adjusted and so one must use “kentucky windage” in order to score desired hits. With enough practice one can be accurate with such a weapon but the operative words are enough practice. The uses described for this toy are plinking and “fun”. The suggested price is $30 for this toy. Is your life really worth no more than $30?

    The short barrel rifle look-alike bb gun that the authoress bought has a muzzle velocity of only 430 fps per the blurb in the upper right hand corner of the package. That is even less than the advertised 500 fps of her Daisy 415. Yeah, it is fully automatic which means in about 1 minute you are done. I didn’t see a brand name or model number so it is impossible for me to check the specs on the obviously Chinese made air rifle. The Chinese can make good air rifles. The Hatsan line of Chinese air rifles have gotten good review in most cases.

    If you want something that can be truly deadly, the Umarex AirJavelin Airgun Rifle is a new way to shoot arrows. Powered by CO2, it launches a 170-grain air bolt at 300 fps and takes airpower into a new direction with 34 ft-lbs of energy, delivered via Straight Flight Technology arrows. Shooters can line up the target with the installed open sights or zero in a dot-sight or scope for pin-point arrow placement. The AirJavelin has a full-length Picatinny rail on the top, along with a short section below the barrel. Both sides of the stock are also equipped with M-LOK slots. It accepts 88-gram CO2 tanks and will launch dozens of arrows downrange on a single tank. The Umarex 2x12g CO2 adapter (01 UM2843) will also install on the it, which is handy for shorter shooting sessions.

    That was the ad verbiage for the device. If you want perhaps — emphasis on the “perhaps” — less than lethal deterrent, a crossbow bolt sticking out of one’s body certainly has a definite deterring factor that may not be present with even a more powerful 9 mm bullet wound.
    It’s in the market place for under $200.00

    When one could buy a Snell approved motorcycle helmet for $30 we used to say to folks who rode without helmets, “Well, if your brain is worth less than $30, then don’t wear a helmet. You know best what your brain is worth to you.” So to switch it a bit, “Is the life of your family only worth $30?”

    I would submit the author would be better off spending the $30 on .22 ammo for her .22 and practicing with it to the point where she knows where the bullet will go every time she presses the trigger.

    If you can’t find a firearm for self defense, then I suggest you look at pcp guns. Look at nothing lower than a .22. I would suggest that the .25 caliber pcp is the best lower cost alternative to the jump to .357 and bigger calibers in pcp. Once you get past .25 caliber the guns take a dramatic turn northward cost wise.

    You want to look at a couple of things in purchasing a pcp for self defense. Don’t be misled by the advertised muzzle velocity. That is the muzzle velocity attained by shooting the non-lead light weight pellets. You want to determine the muzzle velocity shooting standard weight lead .25 caliber pellets or even heavy weight lead pellets in .25 caliber. It should approach 900 feet per second muzzle velocity to be effective as a killing device.

    You want to determine how many pumps with a hand pump it will take to reach maximum reservoir pressure and how many shots that maximum pressure will provide.

    While I stress hand pump, most pcp shooters use an electrical pump to charge their pcps. That’s okay until the grid goes down. They also rent tanks from dive shops and paint ball shops to charge their pcp air guns. That’s okay too until the end of the world and the dive shop is closed.
    A hand pump is there electricity or not. It is there when all shops are closed.

    You must purchase an air rifle. I would suggest that an air rifle is the only air gun that can be a deadly weapon, that will provide enough muzzle velocity to drive a pellet to fatal distances in the human body. The idea that “Oh, if I just hit him with a pellet he will run away” is totally fallacious thinking. In the case that I described above, after being hit 5 times with bean bags from a 12 gauge shotgun and continuing to advance, the deceased was struck 8 times with 9 mm bullets. I’m pretty sure the cops were using 124 grain, plus P, hollow point ammunition. For those who don’t know what plus P is, it is a higher velocity round than the standard round providing higher muzzle velocity and more terminal foot pounds of energy transmitted to the target. It expands hollow pointed ammunition more reliably due to its higher velocity at target distances. While the sequence of the shots causing which wounds is not known, the decedent received, I believe, two fatal injuries to major blood vessels but he didn’t quit advancing until he had been struck 8 times — actually 9 times but one round struck his belt buckle and didn’t penetrate his body.

    While I don’t have first hand knowledge, and hope to avoid acquiring same, it is my understanding that even getting struck on body armor by a 9mm bullet at close range still imparts a stunning blow and the next day the person so struck exhibits an interesting bruise and is stiff and sore.

    If people who want to overrun her property and do harm to her family see her family parading around with bb guns, no matter how “scary” they may look, I suggest the next time those bad guys visit, they will come firing real guns at folks who are trying to defend themselves with sling shots and bb guns. I think that will result in the exact opposite of what this obviously sincere, but woefully lacking in training and experience, ;any wants which is safety for herself and her family.

    This post jumps around a bit and I apologize for that I am under a time constraint this morning and wanted to get this posted before I had to leave for the day.

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      • left coast chuck November 11, 18:53

        The comments on the dpms bb gun ranged from dismal to five stars. It seems it has a short life span and that is believable inasmuch as the parts are plastic and pot metal and it is operating at a high rate of fire.

        The best rifle that outdoor empire recommended, the Daisy Legacy is a .177 caliber and reportedly can reach 1,000 fps which used to be unattainable but now is exceeded by several brands in the market place by 250 or more fps. Also, .177 or bb size pellets certainly would disable an attacker if one were able, under the pressure of an attack manage to put the pellet in the soft part of the neck or the eye. You know, “You’ll shoot your eye out.” I would suggest that is a feat only accidentally attained which accounts for the advice to shoot to body mass and only go for the head shot when you have already put two in the body mass.

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        • red November 12, 02:20

          LCC: Short range, in the house, it might work with a BB gun. I like the sling (not a slingshot, per say) when I have room, and a ball and chain for close work. Nunchaku are great if you have head room in the house, easy to make and learn how to use. Caltrops are pretty good. Even if they don’t penetrate a shoe sole, they stick and throw the person off balance. niio

          Reply to this comment
          • left coast chuck November 12, 19:38

            Red: A couple of large bolts and nuts through the end link of the chain will do in place of a ball or better yet, buy the biggest heaviest duty lock you can find and lock it through the end of the chain. It is a security device then and not a forbidden weapon.

            I made make-do caltrops by taking tin cans and cutting them into spikes. Yeah, they aren’t as efficient as caltrops made out of rebar, but they are effective in channeling b.g.s into lanes of fire. Nobody wants to flop down on a bunch of rusty sharp metal spikes sticking up and as you point out, they are highly annoying to walk on because they do stick to the soles of one’s shoes.

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            • red November 14, 13:10

              LCC: LOL! You do give good advice. I like a light ball and chain. We hunted with them as kids. Even a paracord chain works. A good weight on the end should handle well, be easy to learn, and cause damage. Bigger game, like a raider, calls for heavier weights like that lock. A long chain is great is you’re out in the open, but short ones mean you can work inside or cast it. Slings are good pretty much anywhere as long as you can reload. We learned them and bolos. Given that fossil fuels will run out in the case of a long ‘troubles’, horses will be common and bolos work very well on them. Knock down one or two and often the rest panic. niio

              Reply to this comment
    • Rucksack Rob November 10, 13:26

      As always Chuck, excellent comment. Even if someone is new to prepping, the writing has been on the wall for 40 years or more. (I started ‘prepping’ around 1970) As several of the other commenters replied, ‘ people should have been doing this years ago’. but now they’re only choices are air-guns. I hope the writer has friends or relatives she(they) can linkup with (if necessary). Good Luck to her and her family.

      And yes Claude, as you know, Chuck is very articulate and well spoken (and written), he is knowledgeable and not condescending so I for one, think his article should be posted, it can’t be any worse than some that have been published and it will probably be better than most. Count me as a yes vote. (and rest assured, I won’t be ‘mailing’ in my ballot.)

      Reply to this comment
    • City Chick November 10, 15:52

      LCC – If you are not published here, consider writing a book! Think about it some. Why not take that little step, one step further? Easier to publish today than ever before and the need is great as there is so much bad information out there!

      Reply to this comment
    • PoDunk November 12, 04:32

      Are you SERIOUS?!? BB-guns?? Pellet guns?? REALLY?!?
      Aside from a .45 caliber air-rifle I saw on a Demolition Ranch video… .17 and .22 won’t DO CRAP.
      — Archery equipment would be BETTER.

      Reply to this comment
      • red November 14, 12:13

        Po: You’re 5 feet from the raider. He’s jumping at you. How many arrows can you put in him? That’s the scene. Not enough guns for the family and you can’t buy more for love nor money. That’s the way of the article. When I was 6, I was plinging stray dogs chasing the goats. It worked on them. It works on coyotes. BBs in the face will deter most raiders. Right now, anyone who used a real gun to defend themselves against BLM and antifa are looking at lawsuits. There are plenty of judges and lawyers out there who would be more than happy to give your ‘victim’ your home, your first-born, and see you in jail for any use of a gun. BBs? The cops would be rolling on the floor laughing about it. Deter, not dispose of.

        Reply to this comment
        • Raven tactical November 14, 12:58

          Yeah sorry your going die..

          Reply to this comment
          • red November 14, 20:07

            Raven: Gee, I hope that’s not aimed at me! I’m not. If anyone breaks in, I hope they’re bee lovers. All Arizona honey bees are africanized. Did you know, say, that bees can follow the trajectory of a bullet or rock? I over bees and not once in all my decades have been stung even when raiding wild hives. niio

            Reply to this comment
  11. Williewillnot November 9, 19:35

    I have the Texan SS, 45 Caliber rifle with a suppressor. 800+ fps and will kill deer at over 100 yds. They do make a 30 Caliber Automatic Pellet Rifle. Powerful and can be used single shot or automatic. Price is definitely a high but well worth it..
    But a gun with a suppressor and no federal license.!!!

    Reply to this comment
  12. scrooster November 9, 19:55

    If you are not well armed, well outfitted, well trained and well stocked by the time tshtf … then you may be SOL. BB guns are only going to piss a bad guy off and he’ll only be more likely to torture you unmercifully before he kills yours and you. Well, he probably will not kill your females but …. anyways, get a gun, get some ammo and learn how to use it.

    Reply to this comment
    • City Chick November 14, 15:35

      Scrooster – Very interesting timely info and good to know! We’re moving over and into this now and have just received our bow license. Thank you very much for posting!

      Reply to this comment
  13. Sabel November 9, 20:00

    Of course, the advantage of using bows is that, with the proper, fairly inexpensive, tools and jigs, you can make your own “ammo,” AKA arrows and bolts. We recommend using spruce shafts for primitive bows (recurve and longbows) rather than the typical cedar. They are both easier to source and are more durable. For now, fletching, tips and adhesives can be found fairly easily but, when the supply lines get permanently disrupted, they can be found in nature or manufactured by hand. If you want lessons on how to make arrows and bolts, find a local group of historical reenactors such as SCA or NMLRA.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 22, 23:04

      Good info. Thanks for the post and the references to knowledgable organizations.

      Reply to this comment
    • red November 23, 09:42

      Sabel: Ponderosa is a good, tight hardwood that doesn’t warp easy. If someone wants to do a lot of damage, thick glass is easy to knap. It’s heavy and usually breaks inside the thing shot at. Also, it’ll be readily available if metal grows scarce. Ours are volcanic glass, something not real hard to find in Arizona. niio

      Reply to this comment
  14. TheSouthernNationalist November 9, 20:06

    Those air guns might be alright for small game but no way would I use it for self defense.
    I’d rather have a Gurkha or a machete to use up close and personal.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 9, 23:16

      Totally agree with your comment, TSN. An 18 to 20″ machete with decent steel over a bb gun any day. If that was my sole defense weapon, I would practice swings and thrusts with it each and every day. 50 strokes with the right hand; 50 strokes with the left hand; 100 strokes two handed and then repeat with thrusts, same formula.

      You can’t even kill a squirrel with a bb gun unless you get an extremely lucky shot and hit it in some vulnerable place. Most bb guns are smooth bore and shoot a round pellet, both militating against accuracy. There is a match bb gun that Daisy sells and you can buy match bbs to go in the match bb gun. Both the bore and the bbs are made with more care than the run-of-the-mill bbs and bb guns. They fit to a closer tolerance. You can’t use rotm bbs in a match gun and it is a waste of money to use match bbs in a rotm gun. (rotm=run-of-the-mill)

      Reply to this comment
  15. manimal November 9, 20:47

    boar or bore?

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  16. Gold Coast Rich November 9, 21:29

    Yes BB’s are cheap and plentiful. However The problem is the same. What do you do when there is no CO2 cartridges. I don’t believe there is a way to refill them.
    I don’t have the answer other than have enough and varity of weapons for the situation at hand. Use the weapon that meets the need . One size fits all is not the solution. you will eventually run out of bullits, powder, BB’s Cartridges, etc,etc. You should have weapons that you can make yourself. Just my thoughts.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 9, 23:25

      Rather than spend $30 on a cheap bb gun, especially one that takes CO2 cartridges. Instead, save your bucks and buy a gas piston .177 pellet gun. You can buy some decent ones these days for under $200. At least you can kill squirrels, rabbits (if you get good with it) crows (feed the dog if you can’t eat crow) possum, rats )they will be plentiful and fat) and other small critters.

      Gas piston is better than spring air because you can leave the gas piston cocked and it won’t lose air and won’t damage the seals. I would start looking at such guns with Lothar barrels which are the premium barrel in air guns. I would accept another barrel if it met my accuracy standards. I would urge anyone thinking about an air gun to review the Pyramid Air website. They have customer reviews on just about any air gun in the market. That will give you a starting point so that you aren’t like this lady who doesn’t have a clue about air guns. And she made the further mistake by listening to the clerk at the local version of Wally World who could well know even less than she knows about air guns.

      I didn’t have time this morning to listen to his spiel. Later tonight when things quiet down, I will spend the whole ten minutes of his spiel and see how much he really knows about air guns. If he is selling a 430 fps bb gun for self-defense, I suspect his knowledge is extremely limited. O don’t care how many bbs it wastes per minute.

      Those are strictly screwing around with tin cans on Saturday afternoon guns.

      Reply to this comment
  17. Tarheel November 9, 21:39

    And if you can’t find a BB gun or a sling shot you can always make a rubber band-gun. Maybe you’ll put an eye out.

    Reply to this comment
  18. Tarheel November 9, 21:46

    David took out Goliath with a sling but I’m not that optimistic of my skills in that area.

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    • left coast chuck November 10, 00:44

      Yes, but the slingshot that David used was not your childhood fork slingshot but the deadly slingshot the Roman Army used to sling ballista which were lead balls and they could kill with a head shot. They take considerable skill to be able to use to deadly effect. They also take lots of practice to develop that skill. They have been a weapon of warfare for centuries.

      More recently however, were David to once again undertake to do in Goliath, I feel that he would use a Barrett in .401 Cheyanne or a Barrett in .50 BMG. Mo betta than that bugga slingshot.

      Reply to this comment
      • red November 10, 13:27

        LCC: Yes, and I’m ordering one of the Umarex .22 airpressure and pump. https://www.umarexusa.com/umarex-origin-22-cal-pcp-air-rifle-with-high-pressure-air-hand-pump
        But, on the sling, we used to go hunting with them. There’s always too many rabbit in the hayfields, and you know ammo is always cheap 🙂
        I agree about the BB guns, but this is a woman, not a man. Most woman can’t or don’t want to handle a large gun, and BBs can be deadly in a close situation. Mom never did like ever a .22, tho my grandmother always had her .38 niio

        Reply to this comment
        • left coast chuck November 10, 18:43

          Red: May I assume when you say bbs can be deadly in a close situation you are talking about small birds squirrels and possibly rabbits?

          Have you ever killed anything with a bb gun? Please describe.

          I have only killed one starling at about 10 feet with a bb gun and that was a lucky shot to the head. I think the fall from the tree might have had as much to do with its death as the shot from the bb. I have hit other starlings at about the same distance with no discernible damage to the bird other than a loud squawk and hasty flight.

          I have shot my young companions in the legs covered with denims with no ill effect other than an “Ouch, take this.”

          I have been thusly shot myself and, indeed, have been shot on bare flesh, albeit at some distance, with a bb gun with nothing more than a bb sized bruise to show for it.

          Please describe to us circumstances where you personally know that someone has been fatally shot with a bb.

          Reply to this comment
          • red November 11, 03:55

            LCC: I’m not disagreeing with your post. I’ve been shot with BBs and had to cut them out, had glass lens cracked by them long before CO2 came out. We had them when I was 6 and told to go out and practice.
            I’m not advocating a BB gun, but simply saying she needs something light enough for her. At close range like she was saying, a BB can take out an eye. Personally, I think she’s be better off with a little .22 It can give one hell of a headache, and Dad always used them to kill hogs and cattle we were butchering. niio

            Reply to this comment
  19. AKCoyote November 9, 22:15

    All I can say is wow. Using a BB gun for self defense is like using a butter knife to butcher a moose.

    Reply to this comment
  20. oldtroll November 9, 23:52

    Good God people. You DON’T NEED GUNS & AMO. You have a brain don’t you?
    While it is still up and running, USE THE INTERNET. Learn the basics. THINK FOR YOURSELVES. Right now, I can go to the feed store and the hardware store, & pick up everything I need to make just about ANYTHING I NEED TO PROTECT ME & MINE. ie. my lawn will be nice & green, but it will ROT YOUR FEET OFF BEFORE YOU GET TO MY DOOR. Or MASSIVLY cripple you as soon as you step on MY property. I love you guys. Just let me know when you are coming. LOL

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  21. buckrogers November 10, 00:22

    Susie, don’t bother with a ‘baby gun’, waste of time. Get a crossbow, or breakdown bow while they are still available, stock up on bolts, arrows and practice much as poss. Its just not worth it to have someone mistake a bb playgun for the real thing, what you gonna do?

    Reply to this comment
  22. Illini Warrior November 10, 02:11

    go back down to the Big R >>> this time the ag section of the store – pick out a couple of nice heavy pitch forks …

    you might get in a few good licks before you get shot ….

    Reply to this comment
  23. left coast chuck November 10, 03:03

    This is the airgun that the lady bought:
    Crosman DPMS SBR Full-Auto CO2 Air Rifle
    Tactical Short Barrel Rifle
    Adjustable 6 Position Butt Stock
    AR Compatible Pistol Grip
    Quad Rail forearm for accessory mounting
    Unique muzzle end cap
    Flip up back up iron sights (BUIS)
    Angled Foregrip
    Realistic Weight and Functions
    Blowback bolt-action
    25rd magazine
    Uses 2 12-gram CO2 cartridges
    Length: 26.9” to 30.4”
    Includes BB Speedloader

    I listened to the whole tape. I thought it was 10 minutes but turns out it was only four. The salesman claimed that the toy he was selling was made by DPMS, a company that makes real .223/5.56 firearms. He also claimed it was the most powerful airgun. I don’t know if he meant the most powerful airgun that his company sold which may have been true although I am positive I would not use the adjective “powerful” in connection with a bb gun at regular bb gun muzzle velocities. It is like getting shot with a Red Ryder 25 times (if they hit with all the bbs in the magazine). It also was not correct that the gun was manufactured by DPMS. Crosman licensed the use of the DPMS name to make this toy. Crosman has some fine air guns and they have some really cheap junk. The price point generally indicates which camp the air gun is in.

    The price the lady paid for this air gun is in the same range as other similar air guns.

    We used to shoot each other with Red Ryder bb guns when I was young and a little less experienced than now. It never penetrated our jeans. It stung a little even at the close ranges we shot at each other but never went through denims.

    The price she got it at $169.95 was a pretty decent price. The source I referred to for the info for this post had it at $179.95.

    Amazon had it also around that same price point.

    I think the Umarex was about twice that but the .22 caliber Umarex would penetrate light clothing and skin. The Umarex would be well suited for taking small game, something the SBR would not do unless one scored most of the magazine on the animal, then it would essentially be beaten to death. I was shot on the bare wrist with a Red Ryder during our bb gun wars. Stung like mad and I had a bruise but it didn’t break the skin on my wrist. I used to shoot starlings with my single shot Daisy bb gun. I only managed to kill one when I managed a head shot. Wasn’t where I aimed, the bird was just unlucky. If I managed to hit a bird it squawked and flew away. Most of the time I missed. Hard trigger pull and unadjustable, buckhorn sights do not make for a finely accurate gun, let alone an accurate bb gun.

    I feel badly for this lady. She is looking for self protection and spent her hard earned money and didn’t get what she was looking for. If she had checked pawn shops in her area or the for sale portion of her local paper she might have been able to pick up a used single barrel shotgun for about what she spent for the toy. It would only be single shot, but with slugs, it would be a deadly weapon that would do the job.

    I have seen old timers run a single shot shotgun almost as fast as a pump action shotgun. They hold the extra shells in their left hand and operate the barrel latch and the trigger with their right hand and can put out three shots on birds almost as fast as the guy with the pump action.

    That takes lots of practice, but it sure is effective. Typically they were better shots than the guy with the pump too. They also never take the shotgun from their shoulder while running the three shots.

    Reply to this comment
  24. left coast chuck November 10, 03:12

    Some may question how effective an arrow moving 300 fps would be. I believe 300 fps is considered the minimum for taking medium sized game humanely in this country.

    The bolt weighs 170 grains which is a little heavier than the standard 158 grain .357 magnum bullet. Yeah, but it is only moving at 300 fps. For some reason that I cannot explain, the mechanics of getting hit with a bullet vs. getting hit with a crossbow bolt are different. I think one difference is that the bolt maintains an opening in the body whereas tissue generally closes around a bullet path. Added to the open pathway, movement of the body causes the bolt to move in the body and aggravating the feeling of pain and also creates additional tissue damage.

    Don’t misunderstand my comments. I am not recommending Umarex’s air crossbow as a substitute for a firearm. While the CO2 propelled crossbow may be somewhat faster for repeat shots than a standard crossbow, it doesn’t come close to repeated shooting even of a single action revolver.

    Whatever its drawbacks, the air propelled bolt gun for lack of a better description is infinitely better than either of two bb guns the lady has selected for home defense.

    I have fired CO2 guns in my garage and I can attest to the fact that the CO2 gun is in no way as loud as a .22 handgun or even a .22 rifle.

    A CO2 gun is fine for learning sight picture and general gun handling. Unless it is an expensive target air pistol, it isn’t much good for learning trigger control as the triggers on my air pistols leave a lot to be desired.

    I believe the Crossman #1322 .22 caliber pump air pistol with the detachable shoulder stock is a good pistol fort developing marksmanship and for hunting small game. It has been recommended on several websites as the ideal bug-out gun. It is relatively quiet when shooting it, a major consideration when bugging out to avoid attracting attention and at 10 pumps the velocity is high enough to reliably kill small game if the shooter does his part. The Crossman as you have guessed is a pneumatic air pistol. It is only single shot so it forces marksmanship. It has a decent enough trigger for accurate shooting. If you are just target shooting, 3 pumps will charge the gun enough to propel the pellet 25 feet. Fired at a 1 inch bullseye at 25 feet will teach marksmanship and the gun is accurate enough to do a credible job. You won’t be taking home armloads of medals from winning air gun pistol matches with the Crossman but for under $100 it is a product that can’t be beat. It has been in production since before I was old enough to own a bb gun so there are lots of parts around and any air gunsmith worthy of the name can work on it.

    It is not close to being adequate for self defense. Repeat: It is not close to being adequate for self-defense.

    Reply to this comment
  25. bert November 10, 04:14

    Spear. Simple silent effective and terrifying. Cheap and easy to make. Alexander the great took over the world with a bunch of guys armed with spears. They cause devastating damage. Forget the sword. Those are for movies. Grab the spear when the ammo’s gone. That’s all. Thank You.

    Reply to this comment
    • red November 10, 13:13

      bert: The zulu wiped out a lot of brits in their day with only a spear. When the Xhosa tried to invade the Zulu after apartheid in SA, they sent in 2,000 men with AK47s. The Zulu told them to leave, and clean up that garbage dump of a shanty town. The Xs laughed at them. Zulu went in at dawn and killed most of the men, then burned the town. There were no more problems. yo! 🙂

      Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 10, 19:03

      BERT: I agree to a point. However, Alex’s guys were facing other guys with swords, slingshots, clubs and also spears. They weren’t facing guys with assorted firearms, otherwise Alex would have never gotten his world conquest off the ground.

      Spears can play an important part in armed conflict after the EOTW. In One Second After the author has the good guys walking the battlefield shooting wounded bad guys. My thought was “What a waste of irreplaceable ammunition.”

      There are all kinds of devices that can be used to dispatch wounded bad guys and spears are one of those devices. With a 72″ shaft you won’t have to even get very close to the downed bad guy to dispatch him or her.

      Red talks about the assagai that the Zulus used to great affect. However, their technique for its effectiveness contemplated taking massive casualties to enable the troops further back to close and overpower troops armed with single shot firearms. The Brits learned to respect the Zulus but I think the Zulus battle tactics sucked, especially if you were in the front ranks.

      Both the Japanese and the Chinese tried massed frontal assaults and against modern rapid fire weapons those tactics resulted in success only after sustaining massive casualties. If one has the manpower to sustain those kinds of losses and the political will behind it to accept such losses, they will work. Even with machine guns and flechette firing cannons, if the opposing force is large enough, eventually they will overcome the defenders.

      I am reading a book about Lewis B. Puller, USMC. In it it talks about Guadalcanal and the losses sustained by the Japanese forces. While mass frontal assault nearly carried the day, machine gun and mortar fire resulted in such heavy losses that the Japanese will to continue was broken. A whole regiment of Japanese crack, experienced troops was destroyed, over 5,000 men killed in the attack.

      All of that said, I would still feel better armed with an assagai than a bb gun.

      Reply to this comment
  26. RevIdahoSpud November 10, 04:23

    If you think you are going to scare someone showing them a bb gun you are living in a coma. If you plan on shooting someone if you really have to and do it with a bb gun you’re living in a coma. If you are going to “flash” a gun flash a REAL one. If you have to shoot somebody DO NOT shoot at their feet or in the air to scare them. DO NOT try to shoot them in the leg to wound them. They will take your gun away from you, beat you to within an inch of your life and then…SUE you! Point a real gun at an attacker and aim for center mass, the chest area. If they die that’s OK if you or your family wind up alive after the ordeal. The bb gun stuff is nonsense. A kitchen butcher knife or frying pan would be more practical but again it would probably be taken away and used against you. If you cannot handle a gun try to organize your neighbors into creating a defense association. If a few of them DO have guns they can be strategically stationed to set up a crossfire zone. People attacking your homes makes you justified to defend yourselves with lethal weapons. Stinging a rampaging idiot with a bb gun who will inflict harm on you is ludicrous thinking. I’m sure the lady means well but her solution is as practical as baking rolled mud and pretending it is bread.

    Reply to this comment
  27. clergylady November 10, 07:59

    Well fellas this great graandma has a Tarus judge 45 /’410 , an old 38 revover usual Ioaded with hollow points, a x 410 shotgun. If I pull out the choke it shoots 45 slugs, and a 22 rifle with a 5 shot magazine. I also have 2, 40lb long bows, a crossbow, and some arrows and bolts. I have a couple of slingshots for running off neighbors dogs chasing my barn cats. I have 2 machetes. Quite sharp. Great for cutting brush. I have a heavy cane with some instructions on using it as a weapon but I need it at times to walk because of an old knee injury. I’ve shot at targets since i was 14. My kids grew up shooting. I’ve killed dogs on the run with the 38. They were killing my rabbits.
    Get over the fear of a real firearm. Buy something used and learn to use it. Most of what I have was bought used from a gun shop or pawshop. I grew up with archery but when I wanted to try it again I watched for bows at a seconhand store. The crossbow was from eBay.
    On Social Socurity I live on a tight budget. Obviously I didn’t buy these all at once but one at a time. Ammo, arrows, and boIts are picked up on sale or a little at a time. I had a 1917 303 Enfield. It would have been good for hunting but id have needed ear protection. That bothers my ears so I gave it to a son yearsago. I bought it at a pawn shop realIy cheap because it was missing the safety. I found 6 safetys on ebay. My oldest son put one on for me and traded the rest for some ammo. Nothing except the bows would have been $30 but I’m happy with what have.
    I practice now and then and dry fire to stay fast. I’m working on archery. Using it to strengthen a hand and arm after surgery.
    Try going to an indoor firing range. They often rent weapons. See what you might like. What feels best to you when firing it. See if a gun store might work with you on a layaway.

    Reply to this comment
  28. Central Coast Pirate November 10, 13:50

    My goodness. A whole lot of hoopla for a rather rhetorical issue. The old adage, “don’t bring a knife to a gun fight” is gospel, people!
    If there is someone(s) bent on taking what you have, including your life, GET A GUN! Any gun……and get good with it!
    There is a reason firearms are at the TOP of the self defense list, eh? 🙂

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck November 10, 19:11

      CCP: If you are on the same central coast that I am, you are familiar with the recent spate of bad guys in SoCal using knives to attack cops with poor results for the bad guys.

      There is a reason why for some time the .38 special snub nose was called “an equalizer.” And of course, the old aphorism, “God created man. Samuel Colt made them equal.”

      Reply to this comment
  29. left coast chuck November 11, 03:18

    I guess I should stop beating this dead horse and switch to dried eggs, but I wanted to post an entry level pcp airgun other than what I have already posted.

    “Hatsan Flash QE PCP Air Rifle
    • Precharged Pneumatic
    • Bolt action
    • Skeletonized synthetic stock
    • QuietEnergy fully shrouded barrel (quiet energy means sound suppressor)
    • Includes 2 indexing magazines and single-shot tray
    • Includes quick-fill nozzle
    • Precision rifled and choked barrel (a choked barrel enhances accuracy)
    • Anti-knock system prevents gas wastage when rifle is knocked or bounced (I wasn’t aware this was a problem.)
    • Combo Picatinny and 11mm dovetail rail
    • Quattro Trigger: 2-stage fully-adjustable match trigger
    • Fixed 165cc air cylinder, 200 BAR, 2,900 psi

    “Finally take home a PCP of your own with the Hatsan Flash!
    “The Flash strikes just in time to join the ranks of accessible PCPs that don’t skimp on accessories and quality features.  Quieted by Hatsan’s QE suppression and fueled by a fixed 165cc volume aluminum air cylinder, this backyard friendly rifle slings pellets downrange at speeds up to 1250, 1120, and 900fps in its .177, .22, and .25 calibers.  This power corresponds to hard-hitting muzzle energy of 29, 38, and 40 FPE in .177, .22, and .25 caliber.  
    “Each Flash features a synthetic skeletonized stock for shooting for all weather conditions, and keeps the weight down to a light 5.9lbs.  Each includes a Weaver/Picatinny accessory rail for mounting a bipod, and a combination Weaver/Dovetail mount is ready for the optics system of your choice. The Flash features Hatsan’s 2-stage fully adjustable match Quattro trigger system, ensuring your trigger pulls break clean and smooth.  Each caliber includes two indexing magazines and a single shot tray for placing precision shots.
    “If you’ve wanted to enter the world of PCP airguns but price has held you back, make a bolt for the buy button and make the Flash yours!”

    Price $300.00 For sale at Pyramid airguns, but check the internet to see if there is a better price. Pyramid may be a bit pricier than other companies but so far I have been please with the business I have done with them. That wouldn’t keep me from checking other sources for a much better price. If it is a $10 difference, I would go with Pyramid rather than Big R or whatever the store was. Pyramid knows airguns. The guy at Big R, apparently does not. Hey, it’s miniature Wally World where the Employee of the Month is the one who has been there a whole month already.

    Like Umarax, Hatsan has really poked the stolid airgun industry with startling, low-priced, feature-rich, quality developments in the airgun field. Another big incentive has been the growing intrusions into the rights set forth in the Second Amendment.

    So far the hoplophobes have limited their ill-advised attempts at amending the Constitution to firearms but never fear, once they have stamped out all those nasty dangerous firearms that go on shooting sprees, they will turn their attention to those highly dangerous instruments of mass shooting — airguns.

    In at least two countries that i know of there muzzle velocity of airguns is limited by law. Great Britain and Japan both limit the muzzle velocity of airguns to Red Ryder bb gun velocities, around 450 feet per second. We don’t want to have our kiddies shooting other kiddies’ eyes out, now, do we? Rather than teaching them safe gun handling, just forbid airguns. There! solved that problem.

    Okay, Okay, I will put my soapbox away for the night. You don’t need the bucket of tar and the pillows.

    Reply to this comment
    • bert November 14, 15:40

      i agree with you about the hatsan flash. Saw a video where the tester had a plastic bike helmet. He showed where he used a .177 to make a good dent in the heavy plastic. Then he shot it with the flash in .25. Big difference going up to .25 made. It punched clean through and embedded in the other side. This is a light lethal weapon. It ain’t no bb gun. However rate of fire is very low. Its for hunting game. For that it is an excellent gun.
      In a fight with 6 intruders you and your family would be better served with light bows. Not having guns of course. First person shoots and starts to reload. Wife fires and starts to reload. Kid shoots and starts to reload. Old man fires again. Repeat. Planning the shots. First shots go to take out the leader. Then each member of the defending family has their targets. Mom takes the left and junior takes the right. It isn’t the weapon. Its thinking ahead. Look at your layout and develop a plan. Kill zones. Thats what the military does. They rehearse until the response is second nature.
      Hope everyone is safe and well this holiday season.
      Thats it. Thank You.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck November 22, 23:16

        Good post, bert. Yes, the .25 caliber pellet generates 40 fpe at 900 fps. It won’t be like getting hit with 1 1/4 ounces of OO buck, but it will certainly make an impression you won’t want to repeat.

        Reply to this comment
  30. Bartek November 11, 09:35

    I think the author has made a good contribution here. Harrison has presented a reasonable line of thought about protecting ourselves and our families in less than ideal circumstances. The point she is making is the need for something and has researched one alternative and presented some good information. (I appreciated the comments that elaborated on the possibilities of some more effective air guns).

    We have to think about using whatever we have at hand: pellet guns, pepper spray, tasers, stun guns, swords, machetes, whatever you can acquire or is available. If there were a group of people trying to force their way into my home, I would use anything I could that was at hand to keep them out. If all I had was a can of spray paint spray paint and a Bic lighter, at least the first guy would pay a heavy price and the rest might just consider me too crazy to deal with. (I have a friend that as a child fought off three bigger, older bullies with a broken badminton racquet. They gave up and went on their way because they thought he was psycho. True story).

    So yeah, if you can’t get a firearm (and get good with it), get something and have a plan.

    Again, I enjoyed enjoyed the post and (most) of the comments. Good work.

    Reply to this comment
    • red November 23, 09:50

      Bartek: And, as well, good stocks can be converted into crossbows. I have an old, abused .22 rifle that would work. But, clean it up so it looks useable, and when the law turns on us, that can be found when they do house searches. niio

      Reply to this comment
  31. bert November 12, 04:41

    Very good article. Makes you think.
    First of all a bb gun is usless against people. Especially if they are under the influence. While a .22 is deadly the guy you shot may not even know you shot him. 15 Minuite after he stabs you then he dies. Too late for you. To take down people or big dogs on the spot depend on a shotgun or a 30-30. These have the shock value too stop anything. Still what if there are no guns or ammo? i say if you still have water and power set every big kettle you got on the stove to boil water. A face full for boiling water should slow them down some. Get a coupe sticks of 10 foot rerod. Cut it into 18 inch chunks at a 45 degree angle. Get a dozen heavy duty wood mop handles. Drill a hole in the end. Make the holes small enough that the rerod points fit tight. Instant spear. Smear grease on the point end wood of the shaft so if they grab it you can snatch it away from them and stab them again and again. Don’t stop until they are dead dead dead. Show no mercy. Consider yourself a country that is in a state of war. Your mind is your most powerful weapon. Have two dozen of these set around the house. The bow. Quality 20 and 30 pound bows are cheap on line. They cost around 40 dollars. They are deadly armed with razor tipps. The lower weight bows are easier to draw. You might be able to draw a 60 lbs bow easy but what if you are ill injured or wounded? What if you are killed and your wife and kid are desperately trying to draw the heavy bow to defend themselves? Every member of the household should have a bow and be able to hit the target 20 foot away every time. i had a teacher in junior high school who was a competitive archer. She was also a hunter. She never used any bow over 30 lbs for killing deer. Up close and personal a 30 lbs bow will put an arrow clean through a buck as she said. i believe her. She reminded me of my grandmother. And grandma was usually right. One of the final things is penicillin. Of all items you have that is the most important. It works. An infected tooth can kill you dead. Another excellent product is Listerine. But don’t swish it around you mouth. Take a quarter cap and hold it still flooded around on your teeth. Hold it there until you can’t stand it. Then hold it some more. The pain means its working. i suspect it could also clean wounds. If it kills 99.9 % of the germs in you mouth why wouldn’t it work on a wound?
    So there you go.
    Thank You Mr. Claude!

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  32. left coast chuck November 14, 03:51

    It just so happens that I got the Pyramid Air catalog in the mail today. In addition to hundreds of air guns from low cost bb guns to high dollar, large bore air, pcp airguns costing thousands of dollars there is an airgun to meet your budget. A moderately priced quality spring air or gas piston airgun is an outstanding device for learning shooting basics.

    Some of the large bore pcp, top of the line airguns are suitable for self-defense if fire arms are not available. In fact, it is my personal opinion that a pcp airgun with a hand pump and a back up supply of o-rings and washers to repair ones that wear out is an ideal hunting gun for after the EOTW arrives. It can even serve in a pinch as a self defense weapon in a one on one situation or one on two or three situation. It certainly, however, is not in the category of a 17 round 9 mm handgun or more ideally a semi-auto rifle in .223/5.56. with 30 round magazines.

    A lot of big bore airguns have a barrel which diminishes the sound of the shot. Bear in mind, any projectile that is breaking the sound barrier will make a loud crack in the air. The sound suppressor can mitigate the sound and it diffuses the sound so that it is difficult to judge the direction of the shooter.

    A relative recently returned from hunting in Africa where the guide used a suppressed .300 Winchester magnum as the guest rifle. The relative reported that he was hesitant about shooting the .300 Win mag but that with the suppressor on it, the perceived recoil was much less than his 7 mm Remington magnum rifle.

    Not having ever even seen a .50 caliber air rifle at hand, I have no idea if there is recoil from such a large bore air rifle. I know there is significant sound of the projectile but have no knowledge about the muzzle blast. Of course, with a suppressor on it, the sound would be greatly attenuated.

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