7 EMP Proof Items for Your Bugout Bag

Ben Ayad
By Ben Ayad March 1, 2018 10:31

7 EMP Proof Items for Your Bugout Bag

This post was gladly contributed by Ben Ayad from Outdorrs Time.

There was a time when the world thought the nuclear bomb was as bad as it could get in war. Times have changed, and we know that the one of the most effective ways to attack a modern nation is an electromagnetic pulse. While this attack is silent, unlike the nuclear bomb, the effects of an EMP are vast and terrifying.

EMP experts have said that 90% of the American population would die in the first year following an EMP. That is because the EMP will destroy the nation’s ability to generate and use electricity. This would affect all basic services, infrastructure and of course conveniences. People would quickly get desperate and begin killing each other for resources.

Escaping the effects of an EMP

Your best bet for dealing with an EMP attack is to get away from the masses of people and learn to live without power. When you leave your home behind and head to another location this is often referred to as a bugout. Bugging out requires planning and practice, as well as a bag filled with items that will help you survive your trip and restart your life when you arrive.

Remember to not only focus on the items in your bag, but also the items you wear. Gear for your bugout is crucial. One of the most important pieces of gear for a bugout are good quality waterproof boots.

The path you take and the things you pack in your bugout bag will be critical to your survival.

In this list, we are going to discuss the most important items that you can store in your bugout bag that would be unaffected by the EMP. These items will not require electricity to work, but will be necessary to have for bugging out.

#1. Hand Pump Water Filter

While having a Sawyer filter is very convenient, or even a LifeStraw, I like having a powerful hand pump water filter that can get me water fast for drinking and cooking. These filters work on a simple pump mechanism and your muscle power. They require no electricity and thus are not affected by the EMP.

Katadyn makes a great model that carries well and filters all the water you will need on a bugout. A top notch, hand pump water filter is critical to your bugout success.

#2. Firearm

The goal of your bugout will be to remain hidden from as many people as possible. Following an EMP, you will face no threat as dangerous as the existential one that comes from other humans. There will be panic and violence all around you. If you are unable to avoid human contact, you better be prepared to act against those who would look to do harm to you or your loved ones.

While a firearm will not be affected by the EMP, it still requires proficiency. You must be an active firearm owner. Shooting, cleaning and practicing with your weapon is crucial to your self-defense.

#3. Maps

A bugout attempt isn’t going to get very far without maps. If you think you can navigate for miles without the help of maps, you are making a serious mistake. The average person has very little navigation and orientation training. This means you could get lost, easily, in thick woods near your own home! It only takes getting turned around a couple times.

With a map, you will be able to get a bearing on where you are and use landmarks to find your way.

#4. Lighter

Fire changes everything in survival. It makes a wintry night warm, a dark night bright, food safe to eat and water drinkable. While having fire-starting tools is good, and things like Ferro rods can be very helpful, I recommend keeping at least one butane lighter in your pack. When things are going bad, having access to quick and easy fire can change your whole outlook on life.

Know how to start fire with many tools, but pack a good lighter and some matches to assure you have an easy route to the warmth of fire.

#5. Backpacking Stove

These inexpensive and highly effective pieces of kit offer you some great options when it comes to cooking food and boiling water. My backpacking stove is always in my bag, because even as my fire is starting to burn I can cook on this stove. If I am having trouble getting a nice fire going, I don’t need to wait to eat. These little stoves take up hardly any space and are as light as air. Get a small canister of fuel and a small stove for the best results.

#6. Survival Knife

Easily the most crucial tool for any long-term survival situation, you must have a full tang, well made survival knife that will take a beating. This knife will literally build shelter, butcher meat and improve your odds at self-defense. No survivalist likes to lean on any one tool too much, but the survival knife carries much of the weight in a survival situation.

When choosing a quality knife, look for a blade that is full tang from a quality producer. You’re betting your life on this blade.

#7. Optics

One of the most advanced pieces of technology that you can have access to without electricity is optics. Optics allow you to see what your normal eyes cannot – whether because of distance or low light. This is a huge advantage in a bugout. Its not only crucial for seeing other people before they see you. Optics also allow you to save energy by observing obstructions on your journey long before you reach them.

Mastering the Bugout

There is much more than items and routes involved in a bugout. I will caution you that a bugout is a massive undertaking on its own. If you overestimate your ability to cover ground or to find your way in the woods, you could kill yourself quicker than the EMP attack itself would.

A strong written plan and a route that you have walked before are two crucial pieces of the bugout puzzle.

You may also like:

8 Places to Avoid After the SHTFemp map blackout

The Ultimate Bug Out Home For Just $400 (Video)

10 EMP Proof Items to Hoard

When It Comes To EMP Preparedness You Only Have Two Choices

9 Mind Bending Effects of a Grid Collapsing EMP

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Ben Ayad
By Ben Ayad March 1, 2018 10:31
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  1. Wannabe March 1, 14:54

    Someone on this site seems to be concerned about losing power. Have been a lot of electric related articles lately.⚡️

    Reply to this comment
    • Grizz March 1, 17:08

      Stands to reason, the electric grid is very vulnerable. Everything depends on this grid, cell phone networks, wifi networks Radar system for Air traffic control, most subway systems. Everything and anything technological depends on computers that depends on the Electric grid.

      Reply to this comment
      • Jericho March 5, 04:41

        When it happens people will be standing there with there cell phone going what happened. Well good luck. Should have listened to what is really going on.

        Reply to this comment
    • Lf March 1, 17:50

      It’s because emp threats globally are a hot topic asked about frequently now. It’s not just this site. It’s all over the news everywhere.

      Reply to this comment
    • Claude Davis March 1, 20:54

      Losing power is always something to be concerned about in winter, and the growing risk of an EMP launched by someone like North Korea adds a bit more urgency to it. If enemy planners want to cause maximum damage to the USA, this is the best time of year to launch their attack. An EMP in summer would mess us up, but we’d have a little time to start straightening things out before the weather got cold. In winter the effects would be a lot worse.

      Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty March 4, 19:54

      I live in New England and lost power for 25 hrs during storm. If you live near the coast you are right to worry. Looking over b/o list and #5, aka the one you never thought of, is one of the few that I actually own! LOL!

      Reply to this comment
  2. Bill March 1, 15:56

    Re: maps. A recent trip reminded me of how dependent we are all becoming on GPS, Mapquest etc. loaded into our high tech cars. And I forgot my maps and they still come in handy for quick reference. Plus, the digital systems sometimes conflict, or confuse you about obvious routes to take (unless if you have a map!) Assuming these systems (or the car!) evens run after an EMP,

    Reply to this comment
    • Dottie March 2, 01:00

      GPS! Etc. don’t always keep up to date. A relative was on a trip in Florida and the GPS directed down a certain street/highway. Construction had temporarily changed it to a one way. They were going in the wrong direction with a LOT of traffic coming at them. At night. Could have gotten killed but made it out safely by driving backwards like crazy!

      Reply to this comment
  3. Dino March 1, 16:16

    I like to be informed on how to take care of myself in times of trouble

    Reply to this comment
  4. Mic March 1, 16:36

    The most glaring omission is to your Shelter needs.
    Though you can create many shelters out of natural materials, nothing beats a rain poncho or a tarp to keep you dry. A good blanket, preferably a wool or wool./poly blend, one is a great addition to a bug out bag.

    What good are maps with out a compass and a pace counter? Without direction and distance measurements many people would still get lost.

    Pitch out the camp stove. Learn to cook over a fire pit. Plus where are your cooking pots, utensils, etc?
    How about Food or rations?
    I suggest ration bars are a good choice.

    All weight is a factor and conveniences like the stove are not worth it. Add more food, snares, survival seeds(for a garden after you get settled) or first aid supplies, instead.
    Don’t forget the rule:
    Two of something is one and one is none, if it gets lost or damaged.
    So carry backups or have another plan in case of failures, problems, etc.

    If your bag is overloaded you will not get very far with it before you get worn out.
    So consider carefully the need for an item then its weight and lighter or other alternatives to carrying it.

    Reply to this comment
    • Hoosier Homesteader March 1, 17:58

      Right on about a tarp. That would be EMP proof item #8
      #9 would be a good multi-tool. I keep one on me at all times and use it a lot more than I thought I would when I first got it. You get a lot of functionality out of one small item. They’re always handy to have in a pinch.
      In spite of the omissions Mic pointed out, I enjoyed the article.

      Reply to this comment
  5. Jim K March 1, 17:34

    Be careful with the waterproof boots. You MUST keep your feet dry, but the foot is one part of the body that sweats a lot. Allowing the moisture to escape is a must and a rubber or Gore-Tex lined boot will keep the moisture inside so that you feet will stay wet.

    Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty March 4, 20:03

      Probably should have extra socks and a small size foot/antifungal powder. Blisters are bad for anyone doing a lot of walking, esp if a) fleeing; b) hunting; c) no access to medical. ( People have died from infections of foot injuries)

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck March 6, 02:59

        Some decades ago the U.S. Marine Corps experimented with using antiperspirant on the feet of Marines on hikes to eliminate blisters. They reported that it significantly reduced blisters but did not eliminate them entirely.

        Fast forward to 2001. I did a march in Japan called the Fuji Big Walk. I envisioned a leisurely walk around the sides of Mt. Fuji, enjoying the scenic vistas with stays in Japanese inns in the evenings.

        Wrong, Little Cricket! I now call it the Fuji Death March. We covered 350km in 7 days. That’s an average of 50 km a day. I decided before I started that I was going to try the USMC experiment about antiperspirant on my feet to avoid blisters. Each morning before we started out, I liberally rubbed a.p. on my feet. At the 10:00 am break I again applied same. Same deal at the lunch break and the afternoon break. I developed hot spots but never did develop a blister, a new experience for me as I have a tendency to blistering otherwise. I wouldn’t hike without it now. That is not deodorant. It is antiperspirant. Blisters were very common among the other marchers. Many had multiple blisters on each foot. Marching is an organized sport in Japan and involves long distance marches at a fairly rapid pace for long days. Marchers that belong to marching clubs all line up in the evening to get the name stamp of the group supervisor on their marching cards with the mileage filled in. I guess it gives them bragging rights in their club. I was invited to participate in the march around Okinawa the following month. I politely declined. If you stopped to take photos of famous scenes along the way you had to run to catch up with your platoon. We were divided into groups about the size of a platoon with a platoon leader and we were strictly encouraged to keep in formation with our platoon. One evening we marched past the hotel where we were going to stay to turn around and march back so that the marchers could get in their daily mileage. No thanks. I don’t feel a special need to march an unnecessary 10 km just so I can say I marched 50 km today.

        Reply to this comment
        • Miss Kitty March 6, 04:42

          Great tip about the ap. Is there a particular brand or type that you would recommend?

          Reply to this comment
          • left coast chuck March 7, 02:44

            No, the USMC didn’t recommend any specific brand as I recall. Just be sure it is antiperspirant and not deodorant. Two totally different animals. I didn’t make any deliberate choice. Knowing me, I probably picked the cheapest one.

            Reply to this comment
  6. Silverbullet404 March 1, 17:38

    Any information is good information re; SURVIVAL,provided it is from someone who has been there and done that.

    Reply to this comment
  7. Cap March 1, 18:11

    A map without a compass to orient it correctly and the knowledge to use them correctly is practically useless. Our group spent 6 days in the Calif Sierras with both map and compass and still were lost for 3 days, though we did not know it. Parallel mountain topography was the problem. If you leave your home, you are limited to what you can carry, including food and water. In eastèrn US water should be available but maybe not in the west. Good luck taking a family with kids along.

    Reply to this comment
  8. left coast chuck March 1, 18:26

    While many folks envision trekking somewhere in the event of an EMP/CME, a general article must take into consideration that not everyone will be trekking to Grandpa’s farm to ride out the emergency. If you happen to live in a rural area, that’s fine, but consider how many people are domiciled in the SoCal area. Unless they have a specific destination in mind where they know they will be welcome and there is an adequate supply of food and water, trekking to nowhere is a zero sum game. You may well be better off in your neighborhood where you might have some support and certainly are familiar with the terrain and structures than you would be trekking for weeks to only be in a different neighborhood where nobody knows you nor do they care one whit about your survival. While it looks as if SoCal has lots of national forests and public land available, if you have ever spent a holiday weekend in those lands, you will realize that they will be filled with Bear Gryllis wannabes. Worse yet, there will be a large number of two legged predators who think they are Rambo running amuck. A light weight stove to prepare some hot chocolate, bullion, tea or some other hot item to warm you and provide some quick energy in the back corner of a parking ramp might suddenly be a life saver. Everyone always talks about backpacking as if that is the only way to move gear from one spot to another. I would suggest that you spend some time thinking about a more efficient way to move your bug-out supplies. Many homeless use grocery carts to store and move their belongings. They are sturdy, and mobile. Not too quiet, but they can haul a lot of gear. Here in the PDRK many municipalities are requiring stores with grocery carts to have RFID devices on the wheels to lock up off the premises. It might be extremely handy to have a pair of 8 inch crescent wrenches in your bug-out bag to change out the locking wheel for one that doesn’t lock.

    Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty March 4, 20:10

      An old baby stroller might be better. Smaller, true, but lighter weight and more mobile. Also if you don’t look like you’ve got a lot of stuff people less likely to bother you.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck March 7, 02:57

        Actually, the carrier that I prefer is a two-wheel, fold-up luggage carrier. It is light weight, doesn’t take up much room in the car and is rated at 150 pounds which is way more than I can carry. With my decrepit knees I doubt I could stand up with 150 pounds on my back. The two wheels allow one to traverse paved surfaces and relatively rough surfaces too. Try to get a luggage carrier with larger wheels but avoid wheels that need air. If the trail gets too rugged, it can always be folded up, and the packs carried along with the luggage carrier until smoother surfaces are again available. I can drop the handle of the luggage carrier and get my rifle into action a lot quicker than I can shuck a back pack with sternum strap and waist strap and get my rifle into action. In addition, carrying a rifle on a sling with a back pack is a lot harder than carrying a rifle while pulling a luggage carrier. Yeah, I know, when you were 22 you were able to climb the highest peak in the Hindu kush with 100 pounds in your pack, 250 rounds of .308 in belts around your neck, six grenades and your M-16 with ten loaded mags in your LBV. Well, Cricket, you are not 22 any more and the most exercise you have had in the last eight years has been pushing your plate away from you at TGIFridays. Not especially criticizing you, I’ in the same boat, only it was 60 years ago that I was humping all that and the most exercise I have been getting recently is pulling the cork out of the wine bottle at dinnertime. A man’s gotta know his limitations. (And women too.)

        Reply to this comment
  9. JayGee March 1, 18:57

    You might want to add a small pair of pliers to your bag. Great for picking up a hot pan off that stove so you can add another or a S/S coffee cup. Plus very handy for twisting and cutting wire, tightening hardware, etc. Oh, you might want to add a screwdriver too, one that has both large and small phillips/slots inserts and can be turned from end to end with both drivers and for large/small ends.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck March 1, 19:02

      Your multi-tool should take care of picking up hot pots and pans, wire cutting and driving screws. The reason I suggested crescent wrenches is because they are adjustable to fit most size nuts, both metric and SAE. Two because sometimes you have to grab hold of the nut on the other end. Eight inch is a good size as it is right in the middle size wise, long enough and tough enough to withstand putting something on the end for more torque but small enough to get into tight spots too.

      Reply to this comment
    • MIke March 3, 01:09

      get a multi-tool its all in one

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck March 4, 04:29

        But a multi-tool won’t handle the nuts on the shopping carts. I have checked them out just for that purpose. You only need to replace one wheel, but that involves taking the locking wheel off the cart your are going to take and a free wheel from another cart and installing the free wheel on your cart. Lots of loosing and tightening nuts on axles. Perhaps you could eventually get the nuts off and on, but it would arduous. A couple of 8-inch crescent wrenches would make short work of the switch.

        Reply to this comment
  10. Stan March 1, 21:00

    If you think that the nation’s electrical grid will go dark more or less for good after a cme or nuke attack and the response is to bug out you are a fool. If the power generation capability of the us goes away then EVERY nuclear power plant that was running within a few months of the incident will melt down just as they did in Fukushima. Those reactors all melted down because of a lack of primary power to cool the residual heat of the reactors, not because of damage caused by the quake and tsunami.

    Good luck purifying water and hunting wild game when everything is radioactive

    Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty March 6, 04:55

      If that’s the case we, (and the game) will probably all be dead or dying of radiation poisoning anyway. So unless you happen to be in some remote area not in the radiation plume you should probably give serious consideration to eating your gun. Radiation poisoning is an exceptionally nasty death.

      Reply to this comment
  11. Girlygirl March 1, 21:01

    Putin is warning us:

    In menacing speech, Putin announces new first-strike nuclear missiles. Complains West isn’t listening to his threats. “Listen now,” he warns. “I’m not bluffing.” Here’s the latest.
    by joelcrosenberg

    Reply to this comment
    • Stan March 2, 01:09

      Do you even know what Russian nuclear forces were like before this new missile? Far more than needed to deter the us, no matter if we are talking first strike, second strike or third strike. New missiles change nothing. Us abm capibility was NEVER designed to protect against a Russian attack, and it never would be designed to do that. They have too many missiles. Our own strategic forces protect against a Russian attack, ie: MAD.

      Reply to this comment
  12. Abuck49 March 2, 00:27

    One thing I notice most folks miss for a BOB is the Silcock Key. Look it up , handy tool that will keep you in water if you live in a city with buildings. Of course you’ll need something to put the water in. Costs about $5-$7 any big box hardware store.

    Reply to this comment
    • MIke March 3, 01:04

      Silcock key useless if there’s no power for water pressure

      Reply to this comment
      • Abuck49 March 3, 02:06

        That is true in some cases. But some older bldgs have rooftop tanks and if someone left a tap opener higher up it will work too. Never know unless you try , I keep one anyway ymmv.

        Reply to this comment
      • Enigma March 8, 23:22

        Many older high-rise buildings have ‘stand-pipes’ (part of sprinkler and fire system) which may contain considerable water. Water will be stale, but after boiling, or chlorine- or iodine-shocking, fully safe.

        Reply to this comment
  13. Old & Gray March 2, 00:44

    Some of you folks really scare me. I’ve read 3-5 comments that are either non-secure, make no sense or are definitely not prudent in the arena of thought. Lefty winger coaster please use some prudence when attempting to guide/advise. Otherwise or in contrast, everyone is an expert or easy pickens for me and my brothers. Good luck.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck March 4, 03:32

      I wonder if you could point to some advice that I have proffered that you feel is imprudent. If you are talking about my indicating that I live in Southern California, that’s a big area with lots of folks. As the Calexit folks like to point out if Kallyforniya exits from the other 49 states it would have the 13th largest economy in the world. (They conveniently omit the fact that it also has an incredibly huge unfunded pension liability many times the yearly gross income of the state.)

      As to whether that makes me easy pickin’s for you and your brothers, well, that remains to be seen.

      Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty March 4, 20:20

        If you’re sitting there on the off ramp making hot cocoa on your camp stove I hope you brought enough for everybody! Doing that in an unsecured location will get you and your family dead in about 5 min.

        Reply to this comment
        • left coast chuck March 6, 03:05

          Please notice that I specified the back corner of a PARKING ramp also known in some places as a parking garage, not the off ramp of a highway. A parking ramp on the left coast isn’t really a garage, it is an open air multi-floor concrete and steel structure that is open to the elements on each floor. The top floor is usually uncovered.
          If the ramp has abandoned cars in it, visibility is limited and if one is off in a corner someplace behind some cars one is quite sheltered from casual discovery. In some cases it might be a much safer location than somebody’s backyard for a quick cup of something hot and nourishing.
          Reading the entire post makes for better comprehension.

          Reply to this comment
          • Miss Kitty March 6, 05:02

            Thanks for clarifying that! We don’t have parking ‘ramps’ on the East coast, so even though I read the ENTIRE post without context it made no sense. And usually you are so sensible about such things…

            Reply to this comment
            • left coast chuck March 7, 03:05

              Yes, I figured “parking ramp” was a west coast dialect kind of thing. I guess most parking garages on the other left coast because it certainly isn’t the right coast by a long shot, not with MA, NY, NJ and MD all situated along the Atlantic coast. Anyway, I figure parking ramps are actually garages on the east coast due to things like snow and sleet and rain which occurs so seldomly here on the left coast that we don’t bother building for it. Ramps are cheaper to build than actual garages, so developers go for the cheap. Same deal though, hiding in some back corner of a parking garage is possibly better than brewing up a cuppa in somebody’s back yard.

              Reply to this comment
  14. captain_mike March 2, 01:06

    You forgot a compass. Maps usually work better with a compass.

    Reply to this comment
  15. IvyMike March 2, 01:22

    Map reading is the hardest, when I took orienteering I was voted most likely to start out lost and then get worser. But all of this can be practiced, I’ve got a fire out back burning down to coals and am about to cook dinner out back in the dark. Been a camp cook for years, I can cook you a great meal with one pot and a single burner propane stove. Fixin’ to rain? Figure out how to string up a 9×12 plastic tarp and then sleep under it on a stormy night. Once you figure it out makes a great shelter. You can try just about anything in your backyard or at a nearby State Park, it will make all the difference in the world if you are not just a Prepper but actually prepared.

    Reply to this comment
  16. Enigma March 2, 04:14

    Prior comments about the article’s ‘bug-out pack’ lacks are apposite. A real compass is invaluable for travel. So are water-resistant tarps and lengths of polypropylene and nylon cords.

    Something similar to such a pack would be useful also for a ‘bug-in’. Eventually folk may need to venture forth to forage.

    While nigh everyone else may be bugging out to a National Park or similar place, a wiser move can be simply staying semi-urban or near-rural, thus either staying home or in an abandoned hard-to-access property nearby.

    Rather than simply building a ‘bug-out’ pack, probably a better idea to simply depart cities _now_ while you can do so conveniently, and prepare semi-hidden refuges.

    If a couple, family, or kinship group is involved, everyone can have packs, including some children and elderly folk. (Elderly persons with outdoor and military field experience can be valuable – they can keep you out of trouble. Prevention much better than noisy ‘cures’.) Such auxiliary packs can have lighter and smaller items, including small-caliber rifles or crossbows, while more-capable members carry rifles, shotguns, or crossbows.

    For all situations, I cannot emphasize quietness too greatly. Voices carry in a sudden silence. Gunshots attract attention, most likely the unwelcome kind.

    Knives should be two kinds, the belt-holstered kind and the Kukri / bolo (heavier cutting end like a hatchet) kind. Whomever prepares meals will also welcome knives and implements (ie., military can-openers) made for field-kitchen uses.

    What will be nigh impossible on any enduring basis will be remaining in built-up urban spaces. They are designed and equipped only for existing circumstances, one of which assumes ubiquitous and totally-reliable electrical power and other mod cons.

    Nuclear power stations aren’t inherently as dangerous as supposed. They are generally equipped with diesel generators, so if grid power fails, operators still can perform orderly shutdowns. All that the Fukushima operators needed to do, but failed to do, once the earthquake was detected, was slam in the control rods and stop the fission process. The diesel gensets allowed vessel cooling until that tsunami arrived.

    Reply to this comment
    • Stan March 2, 05:47

      This is positively false. EVERY running reactor at fukushima was properly SCRAMed (shut down via control rods) as soon as the earthquake hit. The reactors melted down from decay heat alone when loss of coolant resulted from backup power loss. Nuclear reactors don’t just stop producing hear after the nuclear reaction stops. A large power plant reactor will have decay heat in the several tens of megawatts even 2 weeks after the reactor is shut down. If this heat isn’t removed then meltdown is inevitable in most designs.

      Now do you seriously want to claim that the backup generators will not only work, but will he supplied with fuel when emp preppers seem to think every device with a single wire or microchip in it is going to burn out, taking us back to the pre-industrial ages for the foreseeable future?

      Reply to this comment
      • Enigma March 2, 06:50

        The _essential_ fault at Fukushima was they building any reactors at all on that seacoast, one known within historical memory to get large earthquakes and tsunami.

        The Bakufu (Shogunate) had erected giant engraved stones (circa 400 years prior) above the highest reach of a prior tsunami, basically saying “Don’t build anything below this level.” But modern brainiacs ‘knew better’ than Medieval warriors. Not.

        However, most reactors in North America weren’t built in such circumstances nor with such hubris. (Well, there’s one deactivated plant on the CA coast.) Such are designed for lengthy diesel-powered cool-down periods after SCAMs.

        Electrical/electronic technologies used in NA reactors tend to be ‘antiquated’ by consumer standards – discrete-transistor or even vacuum-tube stuff. Unworried by EMP effect on such, unless something thermonuclear detonated directly over a reactor site.

        Panics about continent-wide power-downs due a single EMP are excessive. Duration and severity more akin to recent weather events – a few days, perhaps a few weeks. Bad for those chronically ill and like folk, but everyone else can decide to cope and repair.

        What would cause pandemic failure would be a nuclear exchange of 100s of devices with Russia and/or Red China, in which case few in the Northern Hemisphere would be worrying overmuch about cell phones and computers working.

        Reply to this comment
        • Stan March 2, 08:01

          It doesn’t matter if the loss of coolant induced meltdown was the result of unwise site selection or alien invasion. In a case of loss of coolant the reactor will melt down. Period.

          Commercial nuclear reactors are robust systems but nowhere near as robust as you claim. They are full of modern electronics. PLCs galore. Not vacuum tubes.

          Now I am not claiming the nation is going to suffer the loss of everything with a wire in it. Many people in this thread are however. The ones talking about bugging out and living off of the land.

          My point is this is not a credible scenario. If the nation was affected to such an extent, bugging out would not get a viable option.

          I agree with you. Disruptions would be localized and short lived. It would not require bugging out and living off the land.

          BTW, nation wide emp would not need hundreds of nukes. You are talking about a conventional counter force or counter value attack. Emp from ground or even altitude bursts are essentially non existent. You need detonation in what is commonly known as space – and at that altitude far less a number of weapons would be needed for the affects to be seen coast to coast.

          Reply to this comment
          • Enigma March 8, 22:12

            Point about Fukushima is that it’s *sui generis*. Not that many North American sites which are identical.

            Like you, I’m unworried about EMP, unless I happen to be at the wrong place at the right time. Which could happen; I spend much time near strategic military bases.

            Thing about nuclear exchanges is that surviving panicked leaders unlikely to do any ‘fire for effect then observe’ routine. They’ll be more likely to expend a large fraction of ready inventory, and then perhaps think about reserving some remainder.

            Russia and the USA each have a guesstimated 7,000 devices ready to go, with another circa 7,000 in partially-dismantled states in storage or reconditioning. Red China has a guesstimated 500+ devices ready to go. India and Pakistan each circa 100 each, the Zionist entity perhaps 200 (Johnson connived at that atrocity.) France and the UK not presently risks to North America.

            Now that a cash- and resource-desperate North Korea is a player, that regime will be trading nukes for such things as food and more fissionables.

            Reply to this comment
        • left coast chuck March 4, 03:45

          It baffled me too, that the warnings inscribed on the large rocks abvet some of the towns that got wiped out in the Fukushima tsunami were ignored by city planners. It doesn’t take a tsunami expert to realize if waters rushed up as high as was indicated on the rocks, the seawall that had been erected would be useless in the event of a tsunami equalling the one that the rocks warned about.

          HOWEVER, that said, right here in river city, there were floods in historic flood plain areas to the depth of six to eight feet. That was 60 years ago. Guess where city planners have okayed plans to build stores, condos and office buildings? If you guessed where the water 60 years ago was six to eight feet deep, then you win the cigar. The river banks that washed away 60 years ago have not been reinforced with riprap. The river channel has not been dredged deeper. Nothing has changed except that 60 years ago much of the land that was underwater was quarry land and farm land and is now covered with stores, offices and condos. If your office is on the third or higher floors, you are probably going to be okay. If you are on the first floor, you are going to be completely submerged. There was lots of litigation off the flooding 60 years ago. The next time the litigation will be monumental. So really stupid city planning is not limited to Japan.

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          • Enigma March 8, 22:23

            Don’t know what’s wrong with people; you’d think that insurance companies would refuse to let them rebuild in flood zones and on coastlines which get hammered over and over by hurricanes.

            Worked with a crisis junkie once. He was fascinated with hurricanes, so had gotten himself a program which traced the paths of all known storms since the 1800s. There are places along the Gulf shores, eastern Florida, and the eastern-US piedmont where it’s simply stupid to build permanent communities. Tropical storms hit those places over and over, not necessarily in immediate succession, but far more often than others.

            The info isn’t secret, yet apparently few building or buying abodes (and schools and other mass concentration structures) ever seem to ask, much less avoid such zones.

            There are some valleys in the NE USA where nobody sane would build down by the creek/river. There are however hill-benches which could get used.

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      • MIke March 3, 02:27

        A lot of electronic parts would be effected depending on height or/and location of detonation of a CME or EMP attack. This includes Computers operating Nuclear Plants, computers operating the grid, computer and ignition operated vehicles, solar power systems, fuel, wind and water generators. Non-computer operated motors should survive with replacement of electrical and ignition components. Nuclear Plants have diesel powered generators for emergency backup power supply and are suppose to keep 2 weeks of fuel supplies at which from what I last researched most don’t anymore. Melt down radiation would effect a 150 mile radius while runoff would contaminate the rivers and streams off of it. If in the event of such it’d be best to have had a CME or EMP protected radio so to listen to NOAA Weather Radio for Warnings and instructions. That station is suppose to be Protected in the event.

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        • Enigma March 8, 22:38

          Basically, anything miniaturized so as to have Integrated Circuits in them is vulnerable to EMP. IC-containing devices with antennas especially thus. Any consumer-grade gear, including optical-fiber devices, made after circa 1990 likely to have a fatal flaw.

          Devices with old-style large components, ie., vacuum tubes (even the acorn type) and discrete-component solid-state transistors likely to survive as useful. Ham operators with old gear likely good to go, so long as they disconnect antenna leads when their devices are not in actual use.

          Once a first nuke gets detonated, there’s going to be much excitement in governmental circles, and they’re not overly bright. Parts of the western Pacific sea floor got carpeted in perfectly-usable and undamaged gear, vessels, vehicles, and aircraft.

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  17. Zorro March 2, 14:30

    Those of you who have a firearm, pay attention.
    If you discharge a round into someones body, what should you do. If you wound them, do you just leave them or do you call for paramedics, who in turn will report he incident to law enforcement. If the victim becomes deceased, do you call law enforcement or bury them. What action will law enforcement take?
    All these should be considered and decisions made before you draw that hog leg and cock the hammer back

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck March 4, 04:04

      I am not sure if your comments are directed to life as it currently is or after an EOTW event. If it is as conditions presently are, you had better notify the authorities if you are forced to shoot someone. I would highly recommend the book, “Deadly Force, Understanding Your Right to Self Defense” by Massad Ayoob. Mr. Ayoob is a law enforcement officer who has qualified in courts of various jurisdictions as an expert in the use of deadly force. He has testified on behalf of private individuals as well as law enforcement officers who have been charged with illegal use of deadly force. His comments have the force of practical application and in my estimation carry more gravitas than the comments of someone who has not been in that situation or has only had one or two such episodes. Mr. Ayoob has not only been involved in numerous shootings as a police officer but has witnessed first hand the results of litigation involving deadly force.

      On the other hand, if you are talking about after an EOTW situation, almost everyone seems in agreement that organized law enforcement will be, at best, limited to important civic and business locations and that individuals, much more so than now will be pretty much on their own with regard to self-protection. The prudent course, in my opinion, is to evaluate the situation with regard to law enforcement in your own area and make a decision regarding how you will employ force to defend yourself and your family and your property. The situation that may exist in your town may be 180 degrees from the situation that prevails in my town and each of us will have to make decisions based on our own situations. Another factor to consider is whether the chaotic conditions that cause you to have to consider self-defense are short term or long term. Short term would be a situation much like a hurricane, tornado or snow storm. Long term would be a nuclear attack, a terrorist attack on our grid system, EMP or CME event which would be considerably longer term.

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  18. Grizz March 2, 17:45

    Most of the comment ignore a serious aspect, the grid could be impacted by a natural phenomena. There was an event that sut down the North-Eastern Grid in the 80’s. Solar flare, many expert are predicting that a major disruption from a solar flare is not only possible but overdue. A direct blow to our geomagnetic shield could seriously disrupt our electrical grid. http://www.spaceweather.com is a good site if you would like more info about it….

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    • left coast chuck March 4, 04:21

      In either 2016 or 2017 Earth dodged the bullet. There was an X category CME but fortunately, it passed through Earth’s orbit around the sun several days before Earth reached the fatal impact area. CME events have occurred at various intervals through history, but until recent year’s were merely mysterious celestial phenomenon that had no practical effect on men’s lives. It is only in the last decade of the 20th century and now in the 21st century where a CME event can seriously impact our daily lives. If you live in a third world country where the nearest telephone is a day’s walk away and the only electricity in your village is the little generator on the wealthiest villager’s bicycle, then a CME will once again only be an interesting celestial phenomenon. On the other hand, if you live in a high rise in New York City or Shanghai or Tokyo or any other city with a population of more than 500, you are going to be in a world of hurt if a CME impacts Earth. Even the gas that you get for your kitchen stove depends upon electricity to drive the pumps that pressure the lines that bring the gas to your stove. Everything else, absolutely everything depends on a regular source of alternating current to make every aspect of our daily lives work.

      It is interesting how quickly everything has become dependent on electricity. In the 1970s we had a drunk driver take out a pole with a transformer on it. We lost electricity for half a day and part of the evening. My printing company was still able to function partially. Our paper cutter was manual. Our bookkeeping system was manual. Our cash register, while normally run by electricity still had the capability of being cranked by hand, Sure, the presses couldn’t run and some of the other equipment, but we had enough manual equipment that we could perform some functions.

      With the Northridge earthquake in, I think, 1998, the electricity again went out. Now our paper cutter was electric. Our books were maintained on a computer. Our cash register was electronic. We were dead in the water for two days because the electricity was out. At least the telephone still worked and our cars still ran but now if a CME occurs it is questionable whether those two items would still be able to work. Even if they did, the human misery in the urbanized world would be overwhelming.

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      • Claude Davis March 4, 16:23

        That’s a good point there. A coronal mass ejection is basically just a huge EMP, but it’s created by the sun. There’s a high risk of a man-made EMP attack happening, but CMEs are something that DOES happen, and we know this planet has been hit before and will be hit again.

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        • Wannabe March 6, 13:41

          Are there any reports or records in the past about CME’s? Any modern day ones that did effect the electric grids? I would like to know about them.

          Reply to this comment
          • left cost chuck March 7, 03:35

            Yes, the Carrington event occurred in the 1850s. It knocked out telegraph service around the world. It didn’t affect anything else because that was the only thing that used any kind of electricity. Everything else was steam power, water power, windmill or gas from coal. You can find more information about the Carrington Event on line.

            Sometime in the 1990s there was a small CME event that only affected the far eastern edge of Canada. I don’t know the physics involved but it was just a very small segment of Canada that lost power. In the 1990s, of course, not so much was computerized, although electric power was affected. Perhaps in researching the Carrington Event, you can find a reference to the Nova Scotia loss of power due to a CME. Late last year I was reading a book written in the early 1930s about the crusades. The author mentioned that the crusaders saw aurora borealis while they were south of Antioch which is a town in northern Syria. That would put the aurora much further south than the phenomenon is normally seen, so they were probably visualizing the effects of a CME. Telegraph at that time consisted of bugle calls and drum beats and long range telegraph consisted of a horseback rider racing away with a written message. Tent lights were olive oil lamp, so the crusaders merely thought that it was a signal from God that they were on the right side. Of course, the Mohammedans thought it was a signal from God that THEY were on the right side. They were both wrong. It was a sign from God that he was angry with both sides.

            It is only in the last 30 years that the drastic effects of a CME have become important. Large knife switches such as the ones in the Frankenstein movies or the B gangster movies where the warden closes a knife switch to apply the juice to Edward B. Robinson and the lights dim in the penitentiary while E.B fries in the electric chair are not affected by the overloads created by a CME. Then too, all the grids were not interconnected as they are today. It used to be every little electric company was entire unto itself and not a part of the Main. So if ConEd was zapped by a CME, Portland Oregon Municipal Power Authority didn’t miss a beat. Today, we are all a part of the main with the exception of Texas which is a power authority entire unto itself. The rest of us do not need to send out to find out who got zapped, unless we live in Austin, we are all in it together. Bad take-off on John Donne, I know, but couldn’t resist. Sometimes the evil twin just takes control.

            In addition, modern computer technology is highly susceptible to power overloads. That’s why you should have your computer connected to a surge protector so that transitory voltages past 120 volts won’t burn out your computer. If you do computer repair, you have an anti-static mat that you touch first before you touch the mother board, otherwise residual static electricity will fry the mother board. And worst yet, computers control everything. The list of things that computer control is staggering. It starts with your home devices, goes to your motor transportation, airplanes, banking, water supply, natural gas supply, trucking, listing everything that is computer controlled would fill pages. A overload created by a CME or EMP would wipe out almost everything that is controlled by a computer. We would suddenly be thrust back into the 18th century but without the life skills that ordinary folks possessed in that time period and without the infrastructure based on 18th century technology. For instance, spinning wheels were a common household item in the 18th century. When was the last time you saw a spinning wheel at Walmart or Costco? Do you know how to kill and clean a chicken? Every housewife knew how to do that in the 18th century. Does your husband know how to doctor an ill horse or help a cow give birth? That was common knowledge among folks int he 18th century.

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            • Stan March 7, 07:41

              Modern electronics are nowhere nearly as sensitive to damage by emp as you think. These things have been tested in the lab and in many commercial electronics emp only damaged a portion of test hardware at the very highest e field levels. These fields are only seen in a very small footprint under the device that triggers an emp. Problems from a cme would be more wide spread but they would be limited almost exclusively with things connected to VERY long antennas, think power lines miles long.

              If you are truly interested look up the congressional emp report. It’s about 200 pages of hard data from laboratory testing.

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  19. UrbanSurvivor March 7, 00:45

    Another great thing to consider is Mylar Bags. They can protect your electronics from the impacts of an EMP.

    Reply to this comment
    • left cost chuck March 7, 03:36

      Not just any mylar bag. They have to be static protected to be useful. You can buy them but make sure they are static protected before you pop for a bunch of mylar bags.

      Reply to this comment
  20. Enigma March 8, 22:51

    Actually, I’m far more concerned by a CME than any nuke-induced EMP.

    A CME could ‘cook’ all miniaturized circuits on Terra. Everyone within circa a day back to the latter 1800s, and anyone with a chronic health problem (and some newborns) likely to die.

    But some idiot with an ICBM and some MIRV nukes could make our lives briefly more interesting. Before his place got flat, black, and glowing oddly in the nights.

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