6 Items You Should Probably Not Stockpile Long-Term

Rich M.
By Rich M. May 17, 2019 07:24

6 Items You Should Probably Not Stockpile Long-Term

We’ve all found how difficult building a survival stockpile can be. There are so many choices and decisions to make, that it’s easy to take a wrong steer somewhere along the way. Everyone has their own idea of what’s the right stuff to stockpile, and some of those lists seem to contradict each other.

One piece of dangerous advice that’s floating around the internet is to stockpile what your family likes to eat. I say that is dangerous, because most of our families don’t eat all that healthy. So, if we stockpile what they eat as survival food, we may have an awful lot of bulk, without a whole lot of nutrition. We might also find that we have a lot of frozen food, without any way of keeping it frozen.

Sometimes, making a good stockpile is more about what we don’t stockpile, rather than what we do. If we can eliminate enough “bad” stockpiling choices, then we are more likely to end up with enough good choices that will keep us going. That’s what we really need anyway, no matter how we come to that conclusion. So here are my top picks for things that you’re going to be better off avoiding in your stockpile. A few might seem a bit controversial, but allow me to explain.

Junk Food

This one seems like it should be a no-brainer, but it’s not. If you follow that advice to stockpile what your family likes to eat, you’re going to find that you’ve got a lot of junk food and very little real food. Since we’re talking about food for survival, it just makes sense to get the most bang, nutrition-wise, for your buck.

That’s not to say that you can’t have anything to eat that your family will enjoy. There are actually a lot of very healthy food choices out there, even snack food choices, which are tasty. Take granola bars for example. My kids were just as happy with a good granola bar, as they were with one of those el-cheapo pastries that was mostly sugar and flour. Yet, the granola bar was a whole lot more nutritious and since it digested slower, it kept them going for a while.

Now’s the time to start collecting recipes for making good stuff that your family will enjoy eating, which can be made either from your stockpile or what you can grow yourself. Try them out to see if your family likes them. Even make modifications to those recipes, if you need to. That way, you’ll be ready.

Frozen Food

Yes, believe it or not, I’ve actually run across people with a freezer chest full of meat and veggies, as their “emergency food supply.” Considering how easy it is to lose power, that makes no sense whatsoever. They’re likely to lose their entire food stockpile within days, and not be able to do a thing about it.

Long-term food storage means long-term; not “at your convenience.” If it can’t survive 10 or 20 years, without you paying attention to it or doing anything to make sure it stays usable, then it just doesn’t count.

Medicines with Short Shelf Lives

I’m a firm believer in stockpiling medicines. When looting starts, one of the first things that gets hit is the local pharmacy. So, you can be sure that there won’t be any medicines available in the wake of a major disaster.

Here’s the rub though; how long are those medicines going to last? All medicines come with a “use by” date, which most people consider to be their expiration date. But in most cases, the medicines will still be usable long after that date. Most antibiotics in pill form, for example, will still be usable after the date marked on the bottle. But there is no real way of knowing which ones will last and which ones won’t.

About the only medications you can be sure of, are those with a short shelf-life. Insulin, for example, must be kept refrigerated. Once you go past the stated expiration date, you can be sure that the potency of that insulin is beginning to fade. While it still will work, you’ll have to increase the size of the dosage to keep it working.

There is no reliable guide for how long medicines will actually last. The only thing you can do is to run your own tests. That can be risky, especially in the case of drugs which are needed to sustain people with chronic conditions.

Related: The Hidden Truth About Taking Expired Medications

Electronics

I know a lot of people who are stockpiling electronics, with the idea that an EMP is going to take out the electronics that they use every day. Just think about that for a moment. If an EMP takes out your electronics, then what are those people going to use the cell phones, radios and other devices they are stockpiling with? Who is going to be on the other end?

Granted, there are some electronics which will be useful in such a world. But stockpiling a “spare” of everything you use doesn’t really make sense. Rather, it makes sense to figure out what would be useful in a world where electronics no longer work and stockpile just those things.

Related: Tools The Early Pioneers Used on A Daily Basis

Gold & Silver

Here’s a controversial one for you; gold and silver. Most people say that you should stockpile these precious metals for use in an economy where the dollar no longer works. But and this is a very big but, what makes them think that there will be any economy to use that gold and silver in, if the dollar is no longer working?

During World War II, wealthy people in the cities of occupied Europe were traveling to the country with suitcases filled with the family silver, in order to exchange those valuable with farmers for black-market food. It was a good deal for the famers, many of whom became wealthy trading cheese, butter, sausage and ham for silver and gold.

Perhaps the most extreme case of profiteering during World War II was in the siege of Leningrad. There a gold watch would buy you one slice of bread. I’m talking a real gold watch, not one that is just gold plated. Seems to me they would have been better off investing that money in a few pounds of unground wheat and a grain mill, than buying a fancy watch. That way, they could have made themselves many slices of bread.

About the only situations where gold and silver would be usable for trade would be in the wake of an economic collapse, such as the Great Depression or the Argentinean collapse of 1999 or in the wake of a TEOTWAWKI event like an EMP. But in the case of the EMP, it wouldn’t be useful until at least a year after the event, when the 10 percent of people who survived were trying to rebuild their lives.

If you’re thinking of stockpiling gold and silver, wait until after you’ve stockpiled everything else you need. That’s probably about how it would get used in the great scheme of things, after everything else; and you can’t even be sure if it will be used then.

Related: The Overlooked Gold Mine of Post-EMP Survival

Excessive Weapons & Ammunition

Here’s another controversial one for you… I’m as much of a gun nut as anyone out there; but I’ve discovered something important. I can’t shoot more than one at a time. Forget the two pistols of Hollywood; that’s only useful if you don’ t have to hit your target. The only time that second gun does you any good is if you run out of ammo for the first or it breaks.

Now, don’t get me wrong here, I’m really not saying that you only need one gun; I have more than that. The question is, at what point does it become excessive? Once you’ve armed every member of your family and survival team, what are you going to do with the rest of those guns?

Here’s my concern. Let’s say you have a total of 50 guns, between pistols and long guns, in your gun safe. A major disaster hits and you arm everyone in your home before bugging out. That uses up 10 guns. What’s going to happen to the other 40? You might take a couple of them with you as spares or to give you capability that one of your primary guns doesn’t give you; but that’s it. You would be leaving behind a good collection of guns and ammo for someone else to steal.

And that’s exactly what would happen; someone would steal them. Whoever that person would be, I think it’s safe to say that they won’t be someone that you would willingly loan your guns too. So, those “excess” guns are going to help arm the criminal element, who may very well come after you. Doesn’t sound like a good deal to me.

I’m not about to tell you that you can’t have all the guns you want. Nor am I about to tell you how many guns you need to have, in order for your family to survive. All I’m going to do is ask you to think it through. Make sure you have what you need; including spares; then think about what’s going to happen to the rest. I’m sure you’ll make a sensible decision, even if it’s not the one I would make.

Related: How to Make Shotgun Shells at Home? (With Pictures)

Power Tools

Now, this one may not seem like something you’d stockpile; but I’ve seen it done. I’ve actually run into a couple of different people who were stockpiling power tools for use in a post-disaster world. When I asked them about electrical power, they showed me their generator. Then, when I asked them about gasoline, they pointed to the gas tank, which I thought was probably filled with old gas.

They had obviously though things through; but it doesn’t look to me like they thought them through correctly. Rather, they desired to do something and then created the logic to back up what they wanted to do. Not what I would call an accurate assessment of the situation.

The thing is, any of us can apply this same sort of faulty logic to just about anything. While there is always room for new ideas in the prepping and survival community, we need to make sure that our ideas fit into a realistic scenario. Otherwise, all we’re going to do is spend time and effort investing in something that’s not going to do us the least bit of good.

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Rich M.
By Rich M. May 17, 2019 07:24
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124 Comments

  1. Raven tactical May 17, 11:30

    Oh good the emp myths that anything electronic will be destroyed. Maybe because a lot of us are going towards solar and wind as backups. I would strongly disagree with it.

    Gold and silver are more of a extreme hedge and very long term.

    But while he complains about guns… well what you got is all your going have. Their is no mythical resupply.

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    • Wannabe May 17, 15:59

      Guns and ammo can be used as barter tools as well so stock up on a bunch of it. Same with alcohol drinks, cigarettes, chewing tobacco, and whatever else anyone needs. I even have pvc fittings in end of world supply. You just never know.

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      • Dean May 17, 18:37

        The US Army did a study at Ft Deitrick about 10yrs ago on shelf life of both prescription and OTC drugs in an effort to save money by not having to discard “out of date drugs. They found with few exceptions MOST drugs remain viable for decades with little loss of potency. Less than 10% as I recall. The biggest exceptions were drugs that require refrigeration such as diabetes drugs. I dont recall the name of the study but I found it easily with a google search if you want to look it up. The main reason for “expiration dates was to be able to sell NEWLY made drugs to make more money or because they wanted to change the packaging. How can you make money if people simply buy now and store drugs instead of tricking them into buying new drugs by telling them the drugs they have are expired? ESPECIALLY OTC aspirin and such.

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        • Jennifer May 18, 04:51

          The study was called the Shelf-Life Extension Program. Most of the tablets and capsules were shown to be good for years beyond the expiration dates. The exceptions were insulin and most liquid medications.

          Reply to this comment
      • Mark May 18, 00:22

        I’ll keep my guns, ammo, gold, and silver thank you.

        Reply to this comment
      • joe May 18, 00:34

        But only to someone you completely trust, ortherwise they may use the gun and ammo you gave them to kill you

        Reply to this comment
      • TheSouthernNationalist May 18, 14:33

        Agreed, everything from screws, nails, PEX pipe, PEX fittings, the list is endless!
        Stock up on anything you can think of.

        Reply to this comment
      • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:22

        Wannabe,

        Guns and ammo can be used as barter tools as well so stock up on a bunch of it.

        Of all of the barter items one might have, firearms and ammunition are perhaps the ones requiring the most care in trading. I give you something you want for a gun and ammunition and then shoot you and take the rest or I could just wait until nightfall and snipe you.
        I’m not saying not to barter these items; but, think it through and vet your barter partner.

        Reply to this comment
    • red May 18, 10:55

      Guns, he’s talking about excess, not basics. silver and gold are nothing if you starve to death. I go along with wannabe. Solar and wind? That’s a joke. One strong wind storm, no more wind power, and solar gets wiped out by an electric storm. Nothing is failsafe but your ability.

      Reply to this comment
  2. Survivormann99@aol.com May 17, 14:24

    In a long term catastrophe, such as that following an EMP attack, the resulting hunger will easily drive a considerable portion of the population to violence at previously unseen levels. Think a Walmart Black Friday on steroids.

    In such a scenario, those who have nothing more than bare knuckles or a rolled up newspaper with which to defend themselves will be willing to barter for the means to defend themselves.

    After things have gotten simply “spicy,” many who previously eschewed the need for firearms will be inclined to trade many items for the comfort of security and peace of mind a gun will provide for him and his family. A starving man won’t trade his last can of green beans for a firearm, but it is likely that he will trade many other things for one well before he gets to the starvation level.

    Long after a major societal meltdown, people will continue to barter. Trying to cut a Krugerand into pieces for purchases of less valuable, but necessary, items will be problematic. If an ounce of gold is worth $1,300 today, how does one shave off a piece worth $10.00 or $100.00?

    While junk silver would be an alternative, it has little intrinsic value and, in the big scheme of things, is not all that common. Ammunition would be a likely and easily quantifiable substitute.

    Reply to this comment
    • ATR May 17, 17:58

      I agree with everything you said. Gold and Silver are good to have on hand, in moderate supplies. But I have chosen to invest heavily in lead. ( ammo). Because without lead, you will not be able to keep your gold and silver. Once people realize this, I will be able to barter for anything I want with my vast supply of ammo.

      Reply to this comment
    • Rod May 17, 20:22

      Valcambi Combi-bars are a good example of how to carry small amounts of gold with you. Coins are fine for large amount exchanges, but for the smaller exchanges Combi-bars and things like them are what you would use the most.
      I have no fiduciary interest in the company nor anyone that trades in them. They just sound like a good idea to me.

      Reply to this comment
      • Survivormann99@aol.com May 17, 22:10

        Perhaps I just fell off the turnip truck, but I have never heard of these bars, and I expect that most people haven’t either. One of the desirable aspects of junk silver is that pretty much everyone recognizes what they are. (No always, though. I had a friend who was at Best Buy one day. One cashier said to another, “These quarters sound weird when you drop them in the cash drawer.” My friend, seeing that there were eight of them, said, “I’ll trade you.” The cashier happily handed him eight pre-65 silver quarters and he handed the cashier $2.00.)

        One problem with anything other than a governmentally issued coinage, such as silver rounds or bars, or jewelry, etc., leave open the purity question. Fewer people will understand their specific value. A 14 karat gold object is obviously worth less than 18 or 24 karat object.

        Attempting to cut small pieces from a larger piece of gold would require the seller and buyer to have ready access to a scale if much accuracy is desired. Expecting the owner of a barterable item to have a workable scale on hand would be like drawing to an inside straight.

        Reply to this comment
      • Jerry D Young May 18, 02:31

        I do not trust, and will not trust anything that is not US Mint. Especially things that must be proportioned. Way too many ways to have major disagreements on the amounts, even if everyone is trying to be honest about things. Trust is not easy, especially for someone dealing with anything of value that they are not familiar with and do not know the ins and outs and how to avoid being taken advantage of in a situation that could mean life and death to them, or the ones they are responsible for, such as family.

        Just my opinion.

        Reply to this comment
    • Meathead May 17, 23:14

      “Junk Silver” (US Coins) contains 90% silver and IS of value. Currently, a pre-1965 dime is worth $1.04.

      If you were in Venezuela, you would be ecstatic to have a bag of US dimes. A whole chicken costs 1,640,000 Bolivars or 1/4 ounce of silver. Two US dimes would feed you and a couple of others.

      Reply to this comment
  3. Greyman May 17, 15:10

    Spare guns and ammo would be more valuable than gold or silver in a barter economy.

    Reply to this comment
  4. Wannabe May 17, 15:26

    I think all these things on the list are good to stick up on. Solar power will keep the freezer going. It may be one of the first food stores you may have to eat but at least it is safe still frozen. Of course gold and silencer are always good to have. It has stood the test of economics since God created it. Anyway nobody needs to hear my two cents. So here is my one cent. Stock all of it if you can. Use it daily now, rotate it and resupply when needed. We don’t know what scenario will make SHTF. Just have to be prepared. And if someone thinks I’m crazy or down right stupid for having things they think is unnecessary, well then tough _ _ _ _ .

    Reply to this comment
    • Dean May 17, 18:42

      Read the book “One Second After” it’s about exactly the kind of scenario we are talking about happening in a small NC mountain town called Black Mountain. It’s a real town too. It was even used in Congress when they were working on trying to convince the DC morons to do something about hardening our electoral infrastructure.

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      • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:30

        Dean,

        Read the book “One Second After” it’s about exactly the kind of scenario we are talking

        It’s not a bad book; but, misses a lot of factual information. The hordes on the freeway and the little girl passing from lack of insulin are however likely scenarios.
        There are many who have read the book and got started prepping, so it did a good job there, if not on most of the technical details.

        Reply to this comment
      • Linda H May 19, 03:05

        Dean. I read that book . I also read One Year After. Both are great. If those Dumbo’s had hardened the electoral infrastructure instead of wasting all that money on that Trump investigation our country would be safe. They wanted revenge more than they wanted our safety. They waste money everyday that they could use to protect us from an EPA attack. Does that tell you how our government feels about its citizens? This is not new. They have felt this way as I can remember. It has nothing to do with parties. Except for the parties they throw and waste money on so they can get drunk.

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        • Yosemite May 20, 01:02

          LindaH

          This should help you and everyone out……Years ago back in the Late 70s the Carter administration I think.

          It could have been some other administration I recall that Congress wanted to harden the Power Grid an were suppose to be setting $$$$$$$$ aside to secure the grid. I do not recall what actually happened now….
          BUT the equipment was only made in Europe…Germany I think and the company at the time was 10 years or so back ordered.
          Anyway this is the very latest I have seen/read/ or heard about!
          Read the whole article there is some very good info in it!

          ***************************************************************

          Trump signs executive order to make America greater than EMPs

          Order combines hardening against mythical high-altitude attack with space weather readiness.

          SEAN GALLAGHER – 3/27/2019, 3:37 PM

          https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2019/03/trump-signs-executive-order-to-make-america-resilient-to-emps/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ebb%2028.03.19&utm_term=Editorial%20-%20Military%20-%20Early%20Bird%20Brief

          Reply to this comment
        • The Ohio Prepper May 21, 23:16

          Linda H,

          I read that book . I also read One Year After. Both are great.

          They are good stories that have opened the eyes of some; but, they are technically rather weak, since they miss or misrepresent a lot of the technical aspects of an EMP. The fact that someone dies from lack of medications and the depiction of other changes to the “normal” lives of people however, I do think hits the mark.

          If those Dumbo’s had hardened the electoral infrastructure instead of wasting all that money on that Trump investigation our country would be safe.

          I think you meant electrical infrastructure; but, it appears that autocorrect strikes again.
          I also think that there are very few Dumbo’s, since most of them are smart enough to get elected; but, many of them do fall short on ethics, morals, and scruples.

          They wanted revenge more than they wanted our safety. They waste money everyday that they could use to protect us from an EPA attack.

          They’ve been using the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) to attack landowners and companies since it was created in 1970.
          As for EMP protection, they have known about this since the EMP Commission in 2001; but, find that handing out money to ignorant unsuspecting ”entitled” groups will get them votes, more easily than convincing people about some perceived threat.

          Does that tell you how our government feels about its citizens? This is not new. They have felt this way as I can remember. It has nothing to do with parties. Except for the parties they throw and waste money on so they can get drunk.

          These people are drunk all of the time; but, not on alcohol; but, sheer, raw, power. They way they are treating the current predident who dared beat their chosen candidate, whows us that.

          Reply to this comment
  5. left coast chuck May 17, 17:00

    With the national debt as high as it is and with no one in government interested in doing anything about it, a financial collapse is very high on my list of natural disasters. Right after wildfire and major earthquake, a significant devaluation of the dollar is next. Silver and gold will be very handy to have. A five gallon bucket of silver dimes will be worth more than a five gallon bucket of red wheat.

    While a thousand guns such as were found in a Beverly Hills home last week might be a tad much, in my view, multiple guns of the same type and caliber is what is called backup. In other words, three Mossberg 500 12 gauge isn’t too many. Three 5.56 semi-auto rifles isn’t too many. Same with 3 AR-10 style of the same manufacture. Two Glocks in 9mm per person or two Sigs in 9mm per person isn’t too many. In my view there is no such thing as too many magazines or too much ammunition.

    I am reading a book by a survivor of the Balkan unpleasantness of a few years ago. He talks about 1,000 rounds of ammo and using it up in one fire fight. You can’t base your ammo needs on what you used to carry in Nam or the Sandbox because the military always plans on resupply and if the firefight is that extended, there will be ammo from companions who are no longer in the fight. If you are fighting solo, you might be surprised how quickly you run through 5.56.

    In an EOTW scenario, what you have is basically what you have. Few people are going to be willing to barter ammo. IF you are lucky you may pick some up but it is best not to count on it.

    Electronics can play a part in an EOTW situation. You can have information stored on an old computer that hasn’t got the newest, latest, gee-whiz operating system but has hundred of books stored on it and lots of how-to manuals.
    You can store maps on your phone. Your gps may still operate if the satellites haven’t been damaged. They can be re-charged with a solar unit. While eventually the battery will give up the ghost, they should be good for several years. You can use them for entertainment also if you have dvds. Remember those?

    Battery operated tools might be quite handy. A battery operated electric drill is superior to a hand operated drill and a zip saw cuts a lot faster than I can cut with a handsaw. Best to have both, especially if you haven’t been drilling or sawing by hand for some years. It will take a while for your hands to toughen up. I haven’t quite figured out how to charge a battery operated drill with solar panels yet but I know it can be done.

    Reply to this comment
    • Survivormann99@aol.com May 17, 19:32

      Ammo and guns fall in some place on Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs.

      A man who is starving is not going to be interested in trading for a gun and ammo.

      A man who is living in a neighborhood where things are starting to get out of control and good people are becoming victims will likely be interested in bartering for a gun and ammo.

      A man who is starving, but who is attempting to keep away homicidal looters who are going door to door on his street from entering his home will trade pretty much anything he has for a gun and ammo.

      The prospect of immediate, violent death will trump the potential for starvation anytime.

      It all depends on the circumstances.

      It is at some point in between the these types of situations that bartering for guns and ammo is good for the person who needs a gun and ammo and bad for the person who has the gun and ammunition, and vice versa.

      Reply to this comment
    • Clergylady May 18, 06:40

      That is what inverters are for.

      Reply to this comment
    • Clergylady May 18, 08:21

      For my preps I can and dry fruits and vegetables. I garden and save seed. I sew, recycle, and take care of things so they will last. My home is off grid solar, my heat is a rocket stove with a pellet hopper so I can burn pellets, chips from my chipper, and twigs up to 2″ branches 3′ long. I heat my home, water, and cook on it.
      I’m as prepared as I can be with a few more planed things to be done. Nothing fancy or expensive. No gold or silver. No big arsenal. Pretty simple life with simple simple plans. This year I’m adding and replacing grapes, berries and fruit trees. Most of what I’d planted here are 40 years old and many things didn’t survive the 12 years I was gone.
      I do plan on a root cellar and two very different types of greenhouses. I do want to a get 12v solar equipment for my second and currently unused well.
      Some more canning lids would be a good prep.
      I do have solar motion sensor lights and motion alarms around the property. If SHTF many of the lights may be turned off to not stand out. Path lights can be brought inside. I’ve planted cacti and other things along property lines. Mostly not trying to stand out. Many plantings are edibles and shield views of the homes on the property.
      As my moving in finishes up well start moving the tractor and vehicles into the big old shop building. There are three livable residences. No more than one vehicle will stay at each.
      I’d rather eat, have good friends, and appear low key.

      Reply to this comment
      • janie May 18, 17:47

        Clergylady: I have been interested in the use of a rocket stove too. I’m wondering how you did it. Do you have it sitting on a special pad, have it vented, etc. It seems like a much better/cheaper way to go. Any info you can share would be greatly appreciated

        Reply to this comment
        • red May 20, 01:05

          Janie and Jerry: YouTube has a lot of pages on rocket stoves, how-to, and one man builds his of bricks. Another man shows how they made them of clay very early in the history of metallurgy to smelt iron ore.

          Reply to this comment
      • Jerry D Young May 18, 18:28

        Clergylady, I would be very interested in getting more information about the stove you mention. I have not heard of or seen anything like it before.

        A link to the website if they have one, or simply some details if it is a DIY version.

        And I agree with your analysis, too.

        Thank you.

        Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:35

      left coast chuck,

      With the national debt as high as it is and with no one in government interested in doing anything about it, a financial collapse is very high on my list of natural disasters. Right after wildfire and major earthquake, a significant devaluation of the dollar is next. Silver and gold will be very handy to have. A five gallon bucket of silver dimes will be worth more than a five gallon bucket of red wheat.

      The bucket of dimes is already worth more than the wheat; but, it might depend on how hungry you are and whether or not I need or want the dimes.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck May 19, 05:27

        Just shows you that my data banks apparently are defective regarding the price of silver. With all the talk about silver and gold, I went on line to see what silver cost. I found out that a bag of mixed coins with a face value of $25 is selling at one place for $385. I guess I am going to have to sit down and figure out how many ounces are in each type or coin and what the spot price of silver is. That doesn’t sound like a chore I am really looking forward to.

        Reply to this comment
        • Tom May 19, 11:12

          Good line of thinking.
          Weight of pre 1965 coinage

           https://www.google.com/search?ei=bZTfXM3WCMKX0wKC5Y7QCw&q=weight+of+a+pre+1965+dine

          Reply to this comment
        • a411 May 19, 12:24

          @left coast chuck. Most info on gold and silver US and bullion coins is in this article: https://www.theorganicprepper.com/precious-metals-a-preppers-guide-to-gold-and-silver/

          Reply to this comment
        • Tom May 19, 13:05

          Weight of pre 1965 coinage https://www.google.com/search?ei=bZTfXM3WCMKX0wKC5Y7QCw&q=weight+of+a+pre+1965+dine

          ▪ Cent (1864 -1982)weight 3.11 grams.950 copper .05 tin
          Note:
          ▪ Nickel (1866-weight 5 grams.750 copper .250 nickel
          Note:
          ▪ Dimes (1873 -1964)weight 2.5 grams.900 silver .100 copper
          Note: (2.5g × .9 = 2.25g)
          ▪ Quarters (1873-1964)weight 6.25 grams.900 silver .100 copper
          Note: (6.25 g × .9  = 5.625g)
          ▪ Half Dollars (1873-1964)weight 12.5 grams.900 silver .100 copper
          Note: (12.5 g × .9  = 11.25g)

          My calculation: 5¢ is 1 unit.
          Dime: 2 units value,
          Quarters: 5 units value
          Half Dollar: 10 units value

          ▪ Dimes  = 2.25g ÷  (1 unit would be 1.125g)
          ▪ Quarters   = 5.625g  ÷  (1 unit would be 1.125g)
          ▪ Half Dollars   = 11.25g  ÷ 10p (1 unit would be 1.125g)

          .9 (90%) ÷ 9 = .1 × 10 = 1
          1.125g (90%) ÷ 9 = 0.125 × 10 = 1.25

          “…A bag of mixed silver coins with a face value of $25 is selling at one place for $385…”

          My reckoning, 1.25g per 5¢ face value ($0.05 for the youngsters), $25.0 ÷ .05 = 500; 500 × 1.25g = 625g = 22.0462262 oz

          22.0462262 oz of silver, this morning, at soot price of:
          “1 ounce (31.1 grams)$14.82”
          (I’m moving quickly, relying on figures I find. I always thought an ounce was slightly more than 28g, but this is silver site’s figures)
          1oz at $14.82, 22.0462262 oz of silver, would be valued at 326.7250723.

          $385 – 326.73 = 58.27 ÷ 22.0462262 = $ 2.643082742
          They are making $2.64 per ounce if they want $385 today. So, you are buying silver in coins at $14.82 + $2.64 = $17.46 per ounce (at $385), and they would make 17.81% commission on the sale, why, for now, selling us gold and silver is so much better than hoarding it themselves.

          2.64, is to 14.82, as X%, is to 100%
          X/100= 2.64/ 14.82
          X= 2.64 × 100/ 14.82
          X= 264/ 14.82
          X = 17.81%

          My concern–who is it?–I think the person behind Chase Bank, bought billions in silver, with leverage to short the hell out of it. (Not that they need it. They borrow commodities for very little to short the hell out of it, why silver is so undervalued). I don’t know how that would affect commerce. I suspect there is a scheme, just like, (If you can wrap your head around this being a scheme, or you don’t, and believe serendipity brought this on at this perilous time), just like I believe part of the scheme, (the cunning plan in Black Adder parlance), I believe the mad cow-like disease inflicting wild game across the U.S. has been introduced as a way to disrupt people’s ability to survive in a self-sufficient manner. We may have to avoid large game.

          Reply to this comment
          • Yosemite May 20, 01:35

            REMEMBER
            When dealing with precious metals. Gold/Silver/Platinum you are dealing in Troy Ounces and they are different from regular Ounces and Pounds.
            It takes 12 Troy Ounces to equal One Pound.One an buy silver in One Troy Pound bars or larger.

            IF one has any Pre-64 American Currency one should every coin for collectors value before selling or trading as the price of silver alone. You might be surprised at one single coin may be worth…… if it worth more to a collector then bu all means sell that coin/s for that value
            . Take the cash and then use it to buy more silver or whatever. Do this with every coin. You have nothing to and everything to gain.

            Be sure to check Pawn shops for buying or selling Gold / Silver. Check more than one such shops to make sure you found an honest people to deal with.Normally they buy at that day’s market price….I am not sure about the price they sell it to buyer’s at.

            Say you have a silver dollar that might go on the collector list that they will buy at $35.00 or more USD..That is just one out of however many coins you have. You just never know what you may find.

            Reply to this comment
          • The Ohio Prepper May 21, 05:41

            Tom,
            You can find all of that and more @ Coin (in)Flation
            http://www.coinflation.com/

            Reply to this comment
        • The Ohio Prepper May 21, 15:53

          left coast chuck,

          I went on line to see what silver cost. I found out that a bag of mixed coins with a face value of $25 is selling at one place for $385. I guess I am going to have to sit down and figure out how many ounces are in each type or coin and what the spot price of silver is. That doesn’t sound like a chore I am really looking forward to.

          Easy peasy. Just look @ http://www.coinflation.com/
          They list current Bullion (spot) and everything else one needs to complete your task. PM’s have been wacky for a while though, since the gold / silver ratio of around 16:1 lasted for decades; but, now hangs around 60:1. I have a considerable amount I will sell when it gets to a better ratio / silver price.

          Reply to this comment
          • a411 May 22, 03:01

            @left coast chuck. $385 for $25 face value of 90% silver is at least $100 too much. $25 * .715 = 17.875 troy ounces of silver. You should not have to pay more than $1 over silver price (plus shipping, if any). So 17.875 * 15.50 (14.50 melt + 1.00) = $277.

            Your best price will be at a coin show. Pay cash (required at coin shows) and you will be anonymous.

            Reply to this comment
  6. Tom May 17, 17:05

    This may have been broached, but those with a PV/ Battery System will have plenty of power.

    Concerning food, I have been looking at canning. The jar manufacturers are saying you have 18 months of shelf life for canned (jarred) goods. I talked to a country butcher who steered me away from pemmican, saying it tastes awful. I suppose pasta tastes awful if you eat it out of the box. Personally–if I were to eat pasta–there are numerous ways to prepare it. I bet I could go 2 weeks without my family noticing we had repeated a menu. Freeze dryers as well.

    I am very concerned about the rampant mad cow like disease that is running rampant in wild game. I would not be shocked to find out that the enemies of our sovereignty were enlisting scientists to develop the pathogen to introduce into our game supply, to keep us from being independent.

    Reply to this comment
    • Lisa May 17, 23:18

      We in the canning world, are up in arms about the “new” 18 mo jars lids. If you’re serious, go to Lehman’s and buy a sleeve of flats- 250 of both the regular and the wide mouth size. If you’re serious, get stainless steel rings. Keep all the grocery store jars with lugs, can be reused, get an AA canner, will work on a fireplace grate. Hone the craft. Can meat, learn to use it. Part of the recipe for can meats, never written because everyone knows. Boil the jarred meat. Ie, make stew. Listen for the whoosh as you carefully open it, drop it in the pot, then add the rest.
      Oh yes, careful how you take the lid (flat) off, they are reusable.
      I may agree a freeze drier is good, but a bit pricey, so I’ll fall back on canning, and regular drying.

      Reply to this comment
      • Tom May 18, 03:03

        Hi Lisa, Thanks for the response. I am going to follow your suggestions. Here is my non-personal email, tortugato73@gmail.com, (my personal email never goes out in public), I would like to learn more/ plug in to community minded folks. Good evening, Tom

        Reply to this comment
        • Lisa May 19, 03:38

          Tom, check out rebel canner on facebook.
          That was the name a few months back. What makes them rebel, they use the old recipes their ggmothers used, a lot of interesting info there. I learned to “can” milk. Many use canner for disaster preparedness. Think, huricanes, floods, etc.

          Reply to this comment
      • Dinie May 18, 10:39

        Forget those metal ones. Get some reusable tattler lids and learn to use them. Best decision i ever made.

        Reply to this comment
      • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:44

        Lisa,

        We in the canning world, are up in arms about the “new” 18 mo jars lids. If you’re serious, go to Lehman’s and buy a sleeve of flats- 250 of both the regular and the wide mouth size. If you’re serious, get stainless steel rings.

        We’ll be making our annual trip to Lehman’s next month and I will look for the stainless rings.

        I may agree a freeze drier is good, but a bit pricey, so I’ll fall back on canning, and regular drying.

        The freeze dryer is great; but needs to be used along with a normal dehydrator, canning and freezing. The more methods you have, the better off you will be in the long run.

        Reply to this comment
    • Black Swan June 7, 12:15

      Two thoughts regarding canning in glass jars: 1) Be sure your storage for them is good and solid, and put something between jars that could knock together and break.What if the S that HTF is an earthquake or monster storm that does heavy damage to your house, but not enough to force you to bug out? 2) Regarding bugging out, you will most likely have to leave canned food in glass jars behind, because of the need to lighten up regardless of how you are traveling. Dried food in unbreakable packaging will still make the cut, but heavy, breakable jars will not.

      But I will say one thing in favor of canned goods, whether in glass or metal: They are vermin-proof unless the vermin are smart enough to realize they can break open a can or jar. And by vermin, I am thinking specifically of the rats that will likely proliferate in the year following a collapse. I don’t like thinking about that possibility, but my most recent repair here was better sealing of the mortar in the stone part of our foundation. I think I can keep even mice from getting in now, but what if I have a couple of broken windows that I can’t board up quite fast enough, and there are a lot of vermin roaming around? (Save a few rounds of ammo for them, too!)

      Hmmm, that gives me another thought: I do have some spare boards out in the barn, but are they large and numerous enough to board up several windows, if it came to that? Ummm, no. Maybe I need to stock up on some more boards and also a plywood sheet or two. They’d have other uses, and maybe also some barter value. Sounds like a winner.

      Reply to this comment
  7. Chuckles May 17, 17:13

    Regarding electronics. Yes the entertainment items, TV’s, except for maybe a small TV portables, cable receivers, tape and CD/DVD (except perhaps small ones) player’s, etc. forget. But small radios AM/FM/SW, Ham HT’s are worth protecting. Simple pocket protectors are available for Faraday shielding for EMP protection are worth it.

    Reply to this comment
    • Dean May 17, 22:22

      Personally I save silver simply because it is NOT worth as much as gold. In most cases those little slivers of gold you see now being made are more expensive than say a 1oz gold coin. Silver is running between $16 And $21 an ounce depending on what the company charges to sell it to you. A 1 oz silver round or rectangle shaped piece is much easier to manage and to cut smaller pieces off than a 1 oz gold coin. They can both be cut but how much off a $1300 1oz gold coin do.you take for a 5 gal can of gas? A 1oz silver round would be much easier to determine and if you were robbed you wouldn’t lose as much as you would with a si ge gold coin. Lead is also good to have for bullets. Keep pennies and nickles too as both are valuable metals that can be melted down if necessary. EVERY kind of metal will go up in value when the SHTF happens.
      I collect guns for fun NOW so I wont stop and only collect 1 or 2 types worrying about something that may not happen and limit my pleasure NOW. But I will tend to stop like more of 1,2,or 5 types of ammo more than others. Especially .22LR. You can use a soda bottle with a desiccant pouch in it to hold at least 100 .22 rounds or so. Then when you need to barter the amount is already known and handy and you dont have to go and do it right then and possibly give away how much you do have and where.
      I say stockpile anything and everything you want and can afford. But also realize without friends you will likely perish. Estimates say after a nationwide EMP strike with NO nuclear device (yes its possible) or a low yield set off 100 miles up 3 or 4 would take out most electronics that arent hardened against it. And our government has been very slow hardening anything but military things. We will be on our own for years. So be prepared.

      Reply to this comment
  8. Chuckles May 17, 17:24

    Re: Survivormann99. You are right on Gold (tho available down to 1/10 oz). Silver will handle the smaller items.. At roughly $15 an ounce would be handier. Some silver cards are available that can be broken down into smaller denominations. Junk silver coins (pre1965) @90% ) also would be handy.

    Reply to this comment
    • Pontiac man May 18, 21:52

      Just don’t buy your silver off small no name sites. In china they are now making fake silver rounds. use local coin shop or Apex, Silver.com.

      Reply to this comment
  9. Monster May 17, 17:52

    I’ve heard that most battery powered items will not work after an EMP…
    If that is the case, better have a wind-up watch or clock.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck May 18, 04:05

      That is partially true. If the battery operated devices are in a Faraday cage, there is solid indication that they will continue to work as long as you have charged batteries. If it is a device in daily use and sitting out on a desk top, yes, there is a good likelihood that after an EMP it will be toast.
      Like any weapon, an EMP causing device may not work as intended. How many rocket flights have we scrubbed due to a part not working and affecting the flight? How many duds are laying around after a war that have to be carefully disposed of by EOD teams? Ask anyone who has been in combat how many times their personal weapon went “click” instead of “bang”. If you produce one million rounds and have only a .25% defective rate, that still is a lot of dud rounds. So we can only guess at how effective an EMP strike would be. All estimates that you read presuppose an ideal flight path with ideal altitude and all parts of the explosive device working as intended. That said, I would still keep my electronic devices in a Faraday cage. I want to be prepared, not trust to bad luck for the other side.

      Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:52

      Monster,

      I’ve heard that most battery powered items will not work after an EMP

      What you’ve heard is myth, like much of the information surrounding EMP. The pulse can destroy electronics connected to an antenna that includes the power lines into the house. A small battery powered radio not connected to an outside antenna or to a charger connected to the power grid, will likely survive.

      As for wind up clocks, that’s never a bad idea.

      Reply to this comment
    • Crockett May 20, 16:21

      Try solar powered watches. I’ve been wearing my Citizen Eco-Drive for 4 years now every single day and it’s never behind a single minute late.

      Reply to this comment
  10. Sparky May 17, 20:19

    The reason coins today have rough edges is to verify they haven’t been :shaved” a practice from when a gold coin was worth $20 and filing the edge allowed cheaters to have a “pinch” and pass off the coin as a whole. Pre ’65 coins will/do have value above coinage. A small price for having to go thru” the change jar on occasion. I do it yearly and the amount of pre-65’s is fading quickly. Why? I guess I’m not the only one doing it.

    Reply to this comment
    • eldavo May 18, 04:01

      No, that’s completely wrong…coins today have rough edges to assist blind people in identifying different denominations…each type of coin is a different size and has a different pattern or shape. Coin shaving was irrelevant once pure valuable metal coins were stopped being produced.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck May 18, 22:21

        I think you are both correct. Milled edges were first introduced on coins to prevent shaving. Coins are different sizes so that sight impaired folks can tell the difference. Of course, where it really counts, in bills, they are all the same size, so any minor advantage in coins is quickly wiped out in bills.

        I think the more likely reason that coins presently have milled edges is inertia on the part of government employees. The machinery was set up already to mill edges on certain coins and because they “had always done it that way” they continued the practice. At the federal level there is a tremendous amount of “We’ve always done it that way.” Which might have been the latest technology in 1873, but by 2019 might be slightly out of date. I think that the federal government might have finally switched from using the paper sizes they adopted during WWII to save paper which was a critical supply (no, the army doesn’t travel on its stomach, it travels on its paper work). They were still using that oddball sizes up through the 1970s, some 30 years after WWII ended. Of course, it added considerable expense because they had to have special file folder, carbon paper, filing cabinets and when copiers hit the market, special copiers that would handle the odd sized paper while the rest of the United States was operating on 8 .5 x 11 the government was using 8.25 x 10.75 or some such oddball size.

        Reply to this comment
  11. Jerry D Young May 17, 20:28

    I agree with the concept. However, not with several of the items on the list.
    1) Junk food, I agree, is not good to store long term. Primarily because most of it does not have a long shelf life. However, some comfort foods that many consider junk food do have a decent shelf life and will be a major factor in the morale of individuals, which helps the morale of groups. Chocolate in a couple of forms, hard candies, and a few other like items are what I keep.

    2) Frozen foods can be kept long term if one is set up to do it properly. And have the means to preserve that food in other ways just in case the freezer cannot be used.

    3) Short shelf life medications I agree must be considered carefully. If it is a matter of storage conditions, such as insulin and other medications needing refrigeration they can be kept for long periods without commercial electricity. Even without conventional refrigeration. Unless they require near freezing temps (and sometimes even then) there are several methods to make non-electrical cooling devices. Most for very little money. They can extend the life of many of the meds for months. Other limited shelf life items will need to be researched for how their life can be extended, or if they are actually unusable after the printed date or can be used for much longer, even at reduced potency.

    4) As with several of the other items, I agree that a person can be obsessive about electronic devices. Storing large numbers of some of them in Faraday cages is not that good of an idea. Such as dozens of hand-held games. However, having several no-longer-active smartphones; extra radios of all types, especially Amateur radios; some short-range handheld radios; older tablet computers, laptop computers, various computer drives, and other accessories; solar power system components; automotive electronics; and many other items stored in a Faraday cage will be useful in grid down and post EMP scenarios. Because many people will have electrical power from one source or another. All of those devices can be used. There will be people out there, Amateur Radio Operators, some public service organizations that use radios, and others, that will be able to be contacted and information shared. The old smartphones and tablets, if loaded with prepper apps, will provide portable handheld computers that can be used with those apps to have all types of useful information at hand when needed. First-aid, plant identification, land navigation with or without GPS satellites, calculations, and literally dozens, if not hundreds, of other types of uses.

    5) Gold and silver will only be immediately useful in a tiny handful of situations. Their major advantage for preppers is their use after things settle down and a viable economy begins again. As to how to use them, it is a function of need and what a person has stored. For a long time full one-ounce gold coins will not be in much demand. There will be a large number of uses for fractional gold coins, predominately 1/10-ounce US Mint Gold Eagles. A few 1/4-ounce would be good, as well, for those transactions that require more value to be exchanged than US Mint 1-ounce Silver Eagles would be convenient. Smaller transaction will be made with circulated US pre-1965 90% silver dimes and quarters. It will not take long for people that do not know much about precious metals to learn from those that do, and will begin to use them as the early economy begins to recover and strengthen after a major event.

    6) While I agree that a person, even a group, can have excessive numbers of weapons. Not so much ammunition as long as they can afford it without shorting other preps, and have secure places in which to store it. A single, or even two or three guns per person, with a few extras, would be fine for short term. Not much more would be needed. Start adding in the needs for handout guns for those in a group without their own, for people that have joined the group by invitation and do not have adequate arms, wear-and-tear on the weapons especially if not well maintained by inexperienced people, failure of parts, damage due to poor handling, damage occurring in field operations, abandoned weapons loss, seized weapons loss, and long term (100 years and up) use by the original owners and their descendants, and you might need to start off with quite a large number of weapons of various types. And perhaps even more than an ‘excessive’ amount of ammunition. Of course, having the weapons and ammunition does mean also having safe and secure storage for all of them, though not all in one place. It is not that difficult to cache weapons and ammunition, spread them out to those in the group, have some in designated meeting areas, in temporary field locations, and such, also all stored safely and securely.

    7) Although there will be many power tools around for the taking if there is a major event that causes a very large human die-off, having the types that you prefer, have the accessories for, and are familiar with their use is much better than a random tool picked up somewhere. And it is just like with communications gear and refrigeration. There will be power available for the tools if a person simply makes those types of preps. Even cordless tools will be very useful. Perhaps even more so than they are today. Yes, the batteries will eventually give out, but adapters can be made from a battery that no longer works to adapt the voltage from other batteries that can be carried on the belt, with a cord to the gutted battery in the tool. Just using a power converter to adapt AC to the appropriate DC voltage for the tool can be done if preps are made for that ahead of time.

    Things almost never need to be an either/or choice. And, every technology we currently have, except space flight, we will have in some measure, after any disaster no matter how long it takes to recover. Even space flight will be achieved again as civilizations and societies recover and begin to put into use what is now current technology and then begin to advance even futher, until humans are travelling the stars.

    Just my opinion.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck May 18, 04:23

      There is an urban legend that Cheese Whiz has a shelf life of 5,000 years. That might be just slightly exaggerated. I agree that some kinds of junk food might just be comforting in an EOTW situation. If you are despondent about how life looks with no electricity, running water, sewage service, garbage service and having to walk everywhere while keeping a sharp eye out for roving groups of evil doers, a square of chocolate melting in your mouth just might make your day a little brighter. Many writers suggest that such small luxuries can have an enormous impact on one’s outlook and morale. Depression can kill you as quickly as any bacterial disease, so something to give your sagging spirits a boost is, in my view, just as important as antibiotics. In this book I am reading about the madness in the Balkans, the author talks about depression and states that even to this day he has bouts of darkness that afflict him. He states that some of his acquaintances succumbed to depression. He doesn’t go into detail about them. I suspect that it is still to psyche-affecting to talk about.

      Reply to this comment
      • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 03:01

        left coast chuck,

        There is an urban legend that Cheese Whiz has a shelf life of 5,000 years.

        I think you are confusing Cheese Whiz wit Twinkies. LOL

        Reply to this comment
      • Yosemite May 20, 02:34

        Beef Jerky will last so will hard candies. I used to carry around butterscotch or other hard individually wrapped hard candies were light and easy to carry and do not melt like chocolates and give it out to guys we were training …..It seemed it was a morale booster sitting out in fox hole/fighting position in the cold wet rain and mud. ect.
        So hard candies are a good thing one can neer hae to much of.

        People can make their own Rock Candy.. It is easy to make… Need sugar lots of sugar and some string to make it. It would make a good trading good or to give to kids……….
        .

        Reply to this comment
  12. 4579 May 17, 21:49

    What website?

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck May 18, 04:06

      I took a quick look at your website and from a casual 5-minute glance around, it looked very impressive. I fully intend to spend more time exploring it. It certainly looks like you have done an extraordinary amount of research.

      Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 02:57

      4579,
      Click on his name. Clicking mine will get you to a site where you can contact me via email.

      Reply to this comment
  13. J P May 17, 23:55

    If all folks bugged out by oh 15 miles. Wouldn’t that put all folks in the homes of others? Exactly, where are all the millions going to go anyway? I live near mtns. & lots of woods. There’s lots of folks that don’t know diddly of survival unless its put in front of them – where are they going to go? This is going to be real interesting to see. Chances are thee is/are going to be a lot of dead folk out there just not knowing . . .

    Reply to this comment
  14. Vstar2000 May 18, 00:42

    Hey guys, I know the Republicans of America like to vomit on the idea of vegetable oil and Bio-Diesel, but there are several things that make this something to consider for long term survival:
    1) Vegetable Oil can be made from most vegetables. Corn for example can be pressed for oil, with the resulting mash being used both for food and animal feed and alcohol production, and for producing starch. Meanwhile, the corn stalks can be used for paper production, and for producing methanol which gets used with the vegetable oil to produce Bio-diesel.
    2) You can get the how to make info off the internet
    3) If you have a diesel powered generator, then make sure the fuel lines can handle the more aggressive nature of bio-diesel…. well, then you can actually have your power back in case of an EMP
    4) if you cage your Generators in a faraday cage (6 sided wire mesh that is tied to a grounding rod) you might be able to prevent an EMP stopping the generator in the first place.
    5)I would think that survivalists would always be on the look out for things that have multiple purpose value — honestly I don’t see gold or silver qualifying until society starts getting back on its feet. That is something that may not happen – there is too much feudalism in our society today, and that will be magnified when survival is at stake.

    Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 03:13

      Vstar2000,

      I know the Republicans of America like to vomit on the idea of vegetable oil and Bio-Diesel, but there are several things that make this something to consider for long term survival:

      Where did you get this opinion? I’m a conservative (not always republican) and have made and used biodiesel.

      4) if you cage your Generators in a faraday cage (6 sided wire mesh that is tied to a grounding rod) you might be able to prevent an EMP stopping the generator in the first place.

      First of all you don’t need to ground a Faraday enclosure and my propane fire genset will run quite well after an EMP since all of the plumbing and wiring are underground &/or shielded.
      Grounding is however useful for lightning protection, since lightning has a ground potential absent in an EMP.

      5)I would think that survivalists would always be on the look out for things that have multiple purpose value

      All of the ones I know are; but, then you might just like to make assertions, potentially based on limited exposure to the lifestyle.

      Reply to this comment
  15. Tom May 18, 01:41

    Hi, This message is for the woman who responded to my post about canning. I will follow your advise. I bought a Presto 37 quart akuminum canner, but I will buy the American canner, You said AA, I am assuming you are speaking of the… just looked it up, All American. I will look at the Lehmann site, I will buy stainless lids, you said flats, I will learn how long the cans will keep, I will be careful opening my cans, I want to learn more.

    Reply to this comment
    • Lisa May 19, 03:32

      Tom, check out canning books, the older the edition the better. Our grandparents canned everything, meat included. It is doable. Yes and AA is an All American.
      This doesn’t have a rubber gasket, which is why it is so usable.

      Reply to this comment
      • Tom May 19, 11:30

        My html is going wonky, I never got this reply, tripped onto it. In going to get an AS, I have a 27 qt. Presto. I’ve canned ghee, chicken, beef, both beef & chicken stock, my chicken is more half & half broth & stock, the beef is traditional stock. I will make broth. I did a raw pack of both. I saw the first endeavor as a first attempt, and will not keep it long term. I will brown some and do hot packs next. I want to learn to use the Library of a Congress, always thought of it as off limits to the public. I went to Lehmanns site, looked at all their canning offerings, no stainless lids. I will call them. I live without electricity, so I can only charge my phone. I am building an electrical circuit soon. I would love to have someone who has skills whom I could look to for support, and whom I could give support to. My impersonal email, I offer in public, tortugato73@gmail.com. I want to get rid of Google, that I learned the other day, supports the Chinese government, but does not support the U.S. government. Best Regards, Tom

        Reply to this comment
        • The Ohio Prepper May 21, 16:35

          Tom,

          My html is going wonky, I never got this reply, tripped onto it.

          It’s not your HTML or browser; but, the way they are managing this site. I frequent numerous other preparedness sites and this is by far the one that is hardest to work with.

          In going to get an AS, I have a 27 qt. Presto. I’ve canned ghee, chicken, beef, both beef & chicken stock, my chicken is more half & half broth & stock, the beef is traditional stock. I will make broth. I did a raw pack of both. I saw the first endeavor as a first attempt, and will not keep it long term. I will brown some and do hot packs next.

          Hot or cold pack only changes the texture of the final product. The important difference is hot water bath or pressure canning. Any low acid food like meat and vegetables MUST be pressure canned to kill off any Clostridium Botulinum spores. Acidic foods with a pH of 4.6 or lower, which can include pickled vegetables & meat may be water bath canned. I still use a 45 year old Mirro for pressure canning; but, have an All American on the wish list.

          I went to Lehmanns site, looked at all their canning offerings, no stainless lids.

          They don’t offer stainless; but, they do have bulk lids, plastic lids, and the tattler reusable lids. We are planning on our annual pilgrimage to Lehman’s next month since it’s only about a 2 hour drive. While it’s still a neat place, unfortunately it has been ”discovered” and is now a tourist destination; but, still with good old timey gear.

          I live without electricity, so I can only charge my phone. I am building an electrical circuit soon. I would love to have someone who has skills whom I could look to for support, and whom I could give support to.

          I’m a retired engineer and will help as much as I can remotely.

          My impersonal email, I offer in public, tortugato73@gmail.com.

          I don’t generally list my email, since screen scrapers collect these and sell them to spammers; but, if you click on my name ”The Ohio Prepper” at the top of this message, you will be taken to a website where you can send me an email. Just include your name & mention this sites name.

          I want to get rid of Google, that I learned the other day, supports the Chinese government, but does not support the U.S. government.

          That’s not Google; but, some of their snowflake millennial employees who have been seduced by Bernie Sanders and his ilk.
          As I understand it, Google Facial Rec & A.I. are still being supplied to the US DOD.

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  16. Tom May 18, 03:10

    Someone mentioned feudalism, (i.e.; slavery), I think the path to destruction of civilization is being driven by those who want to enslave us. I learned that there was no way all the high counts of Jews were killed because there was never enough fuel to burn so many bodies. I learned that there was a Nazi/Zionist partnership, culling Jews to send to Palestine, and as much as I want to vilify Soros, his 60 Minutes interview made it sound like what I heard, that Jewish families were vetted at camps, those deemed less valuable stayed at the camps, and those with skills were sent to Palestine. The FEMA camps, and the construction at Wal-Mart’s back when they expected Hillary to win sounded like the same kind of vetting camps, to cull Americans for retraining, and plugging into a new society, (world order). We don’t know what it will be like. I think some will be able to hide from the round-up, be able to stand up, guerrilla warfare, etc…

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck May 18, 04:46

      Tom, I think that you are badly misinformed. Not all prisoners of the Nazi concentration camps were burned. If you will read eye-witness accounts of U.S. troops who were involved in reaching various camps at the end of WWII, you will learn that there were massive graves, many of which were still open in which bodies were stacked like wood or garbage.

      It has long been my personal opinion that if the Nazis hadn’t wasted so much effort on killing Jews, Poles, Russians, Communists, Catholics and all the other people in addition to the Jews they had confined in their concentration camps, they might have had better success in the war. They diverted an enormous amount of resources and manpower to rid their world of “undesirables”. Had they not been so obsessed with that pursuit, they would have had a significant amount of extra manpower and a lot of war material with which to pursue the war effort.

      There wasn’t a significant flow of Jewish refugees to Palestine until after the war was over. In the period after the war with Europe in shambles, hundreds of thousands if not millions of people were left homeless due to the occupation of various countries by the communist forces. Even if they wanted to return to their homeland, there was so much destruction that there was nothing to return to. If a battle had been fought on farmland, the damage to the soil from the explosives and the chemicals spilled left the ground barren for years.

      Too many talented Jews perished in the death camps to give any credence to what you postulate. I didn’t see Mr. Soros’ interview on 60 minutes, but that program is notorious for falsehoods of a significant degree. It has sunken in credibility far down from its early days as have all the news sources you see on the boob tube today. If 60 minutes announced that today was Friday, I would verify that statement with a calendar check. They have been caught cheating and setting false conditions too many times to give them even a scintilla of credibility, especially on something that flies in the face of reality.

      Reply to this comment
      • Tom May 18, 20:28

        Hi, I could go over your response carefully later. I think k I made a response. I’m trying to find someone named Tex who responded to me. I don’t dispute big pits with bodies. I’ve seen the photos. I am pro-Jewish people, (though anti-fake Jewish abusers of the world population h environment). You no doubt are ignorant of the fact that Germany did not lose the war. They moved operations to Antarctica. Admiral Bird took a fleet there in the late ’40s, and was annihilated, came back in defeat. They perfected technology that has been hidden. Anyway, if you know things are facts because your favorite news entertainer said it on the nightly news, you no doubt believe tgings because you are told to. What I said is all documented. Like the Buddhist koan, “If a tree falls in the wilderness, and no one hears it, did it make a sound?,” I have a parallel, “If a tree falls in the wilderness, and everyone is rounded up and murdered for a hundred miles, and the tree is hauled away, the workers murdered too, not did it make a sound, did the tree ever exist?” Some people are content to believe what they are told. I don’t care how the facts fall, one way or another, but I don’t want a false narrative.

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      • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 03:16

        left coast chuck,
        Well stated!!!

        Reply to this comment
      • red May 20, 01:21

        left-coast chuck, yep! My stepmother was in the Schutzstaffel, made captain, and were she still alive, she’d be saying you hit the nail on the head. Soros still reminisces about his days with the Gestapo, hunting down his own relatives to sell to the Nazis. When Joe Kennedy joined the Nazi Party, that was the beginning of the end for the US. niio

        Reply to this comment
    • Raven tactical May 18, 11:50

      Oh yeah all those non existent FEMA camps

      Reply to this comment
    • Tex May 18, 19:34

      I’d like to know where you “learned” all this information you are sharing with us. Where did you get the info on the lack of fuel to burn concentration camp victims? In what book did you learn about the “Nazi/Zionist partnership”? Lastly, where are all the FEMA camps located? It’s almost time for my summer vacation and I’d like to visit a few and take some photos. Finally, I have a feeling what you have “learned” is about as useless as what falls out of my horse’s butt…….

      Reply to this comment
  17. Tom May 18, 05:46

    The html is screwing up on me. I wanted to reply to a post I made. I think it was Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes, 30 years ago, who upon hearing that Soros worked with the Nazis confiscating their property, and Wallace said, “That must have caused years on a psychiatrists couch,” Soros replied, “Not at all, Not at all, It was the best time of my life.” This, the leader of progressive Democrat politics.

    There were photos found a few years ago, of Nuremburg I believe, that bely testimony about the camps. The news services didn’t start lying to us a decade ago, they have been our enemy for at least 150 years. Lies. Robert Sepehr, the anthropologist, has pictures of the coins minted, commemorating the partnership between the Nazis and the Zionists. Today, the ones who celebrated and supported the Jew’s plight today celebrate and support the Muslim cause, to the detriment of Jewish people, whom I am supportive of. But, I do not feel the need to prop up a false narrative. Jewish, Christian, gay, Gypsy, and others suffered under Nazism, but people don’t understand, the Nazi movement, like Bolshevicism, Zionism, Jacobinism, Bohemian Grove, Illuminati, Masonic Right, Antifa, BLM, BAMN, and other groups are just the hand puppets of globalist financiers. None of rhose groups are real, just fake groups set up to hide behind.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck May 18, 22:10

      What is the url for the pictures that Robert Sepher, “anthropologist has” commemorating the union between Zionists and Nazis? I would like to look at them myself. Or is viewing those incriminating coins limited to only a select few?

      While the Bureau of Land Management is particularly inept in their handling of the federal lands that they are supposedly entrusted with caring for, I hardly think that the folks driving around in green pickups are part of a vast international conspiracy to rule the world. It think their biggest concern is to reach retirement age without rocking the boat and trying to bootstrap their individual segment of the BLM so that they can get more employees and perhaps a management position. One thing you can bet your bottom dollar on is that they constantly have their moistened finger in the air seeing which way the wind is blowing from Washington.

      Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 03:21

      Tom,
      My memories from various sources indicate that George Soros (a jew) was instrumental in sorting out those undesirables and helping ship them off to the camps. He seems to be the total narcissist with no morals, ethics, or scruples; but, does have a knack for making money, which those other attributes would probably help.

      Reply to this comment
  18. Alfredo May 18, 09:09

    Hello, I am a South African. Some of you might know that we are on the brink of a revolution or for a lack of better word, a genocide. I am making a cache of silver & gold for myself & my family. Sooner or later it will be over & that cache will be for a new beginning for us. That is should any of us survive it…

    Reply to this comment
    • Wannabe May 18, 14:44

      Thankyou for sharing Alfredo. Please keep us informed about what is going on over there because the media is not going to. Just like Puerto Rico and Venezuela everything is hush hush because the left wing mainstream media in America is for the dictatorships in power and don’t want the citizens to have any true coverage. I’m sorry you are going through this, do what you can to survive even if it means leaving if possible. Thankyou again for sharing. We are thinking and praying for you all.

      Reply to this comment
      • CarmenO May 19, 12:55

        Wannabe, it took a while for this nonsense to show up, after my comment made it here. I hope you read it. Summary: Puerto Ricans – US CITIZENS FROM BIRTH for the last ONE HUNDRED AND THREE YEARS. Are you calling the US: “the dictatorships in power” being that PR is part of the US, since it was invaded in 1898? What are you a Democrat? Plus, guess what, PR recovered long ago from the TWO hurricanes in a row that hit the island. Not even remotely like Venezuela. By the way, not only do most P Ricans have to file the US FEDERAL income return and pay taxes, they also pay taxes called “tariffs” that no one in the states pay, that apply to even food which people in the states don’t pay taxes on. Sure US citizens move to other nations and still have to file, but US citizens an hour away from Florida by plane, somehow don’t have to pay taxes? I would suggest researching facts before making ridiculous comments. Plus most P Rican vote Republican and the governor of PR is affiliated to the Republican party and was elected by the people of PR. Stop spreading lies and believing in the Fake Media, while claiming to not believe the Fake Media.

        Reply to this comment
      • CarmenO May 19, 13:55

        Once again I get Wannabe comment before I shows up here. Here you go: Wannabe, your user name fits perfectly, as in sound intelligent while posting nonsense. First of all there is nothing similar between two hurricanes hitting, one after the other, a group of small islands and a dictatorship like Venezuela. Since you are talking about both in a same sentence, all in that sentence would apply to both. First of all no one has been arrested and jailed, that said, San Juan is one of 78 counties is PR and the mayor of San Juan, one of 78 mayor, or slightly over 1.2% of all mayors in PR. She happens to be one of the few people affiliated to the Democrat party, and was paid for by the Fake media, and you use that to attack all Puerto Ricans? Get real, the problem was FEMA and Homeland Security. They misplaced all the supplies to fix the power grid in PR, they were found, finally, by a man assigned by the governor of PR, in one of FEMA’s and HS storage sheds. In fact, it took an ENTIRE year for FEMA to discover over ONE MILLION water bottles in – get this- the DOCK where FEMA placed them. All had to be thrown out because plastic bottles and heat does not go together (as in toxic). FEMA paid at least two people more than ONE HUNDRED MILLION dollars for food to feed people in PR; the woman who got the bulk it NEVER DELIVERED a single meal; the guy was sending SNACKS instead of bags of rice and beans to feed people. Both came out in the news by non-fake media. Let me not forget that HS would not give permission for other nations to ship food to PR and would not allow the US NAVY hospital ship to dock, to treat people who were dying for lack of electricity. So, stupid people blame PR? Known fact in the US: FEMA has been dropping the ball since Katrina and every disaster since then, but somehow they did every thing right in PR? That included the two hurricanes in Texas and Florida just before PR. Maybe you can check the videos where people in both were trying to find the FEMA people. The tiny Cajun Navy helped more people than FEMA in both, but were NOT allowed to go help in PR by FEMA and HS. They posted a video from their storage shed with supplies for PR that were not allowed in. Stop spreading lies. The truth will set you free, lies just fester.

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        • red May 20, 01:38

          walk in beauty, CarmenO. I have friends and family from the jewel of the Caribbean, Puerto Rico, Tainos. No, the DNC was never friends with anyone not wealthy and white. When I give a hostory lesson, I always tell kids to put a letter behind the name of those who were friends, and our enemies. D is most common for the enemy. Thank you for posting. Hope we hear more how YOU are doing, and the folks. I know too many in my area who don’t do anything because they don’t believe, yet all are conservatives! When they ask why I’m doing something, I say because it reminds me of help the grandparents or parent. That they can relate to. be blessed.

          Reply to this comment
    • Clergylady May 18, 16:57

      The don’t hear about this in our news. at is what inverters are for.
      Thank you
      Prayers for you and your family first for a healthy survival then for your role in rebuilding if this indeed does come to war.
      God Bless

      Reply to this comment
  19. Illini Warrior May 18, 11:23

    I disagree to an extent on your firearms math – you have 10 group members with trigger fingers – and 50 various weapons in inventory? – and that’s excessive?

    You immediately have 20 primary long arm defense weapons for the group between use and backup – same same with sidearms – then you get into specialties like sniper rifles that should equip half the group .. then there’s hunting??? – between small caliber – large game and the variety of shotguns involved you have 10s more ….

    50 firearms tooooo much – I disagree …

    Reply to this comment
    • red May 20, 00:09

      Donno. My ex in Mexico says it’s amazing how many M16s and ammo can be just picked up…At least after the drug lord’s men take a short trip over a tall cliff. 🙂

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  20. CarmenO May 18, 12:37

    Talk about “what kind of stupid advice is that”? First of all, you should stock pile some junk food if you have children, to keep them feeling normal in a very bad situation. Example: hard candy, things they enjoy eating that are “not good for you”. The SHTF is NOT a time to train them to eat healthy, it should happen way before. Second: stock up on medicines? How about find healthy alternatives BEFORE the SHTF. Any one who looks through Merck Manual of Prescription Drugs, will avoid the same like the plague (as in me). When the side effects of what you take include death, or worse conditions, you know there is a problem. Try looking up anything you take. I’m sticking with aspirin. While not a cure or the first choice, someone who suffers from the very common diabetes should look up Jerusalem Artichokes. (The plants look like sunflowers and the edible bulbs grows underground and survive Minnesota winters.) Just one example but try a book on herbal medicines, in case pharmacies become a thing of the past. Of course anything that depends in electricity is a no, no. Gold is a joke (try buying a loaf of bread with a gold coin, hint you will not get change back) but silver is an option, especially if you are a silver smith and can get it for cheaper (I got mine for way cheaper when I was a silver smith: I’ve been a LOT of things, like acquiring knowledge.) As to the meat in freezer, I cross my fingers during our short warm season, but I do know how to turn it into dehydrated meat, if necessary, and have all the necessary equipment and spices. (You can call it jerky, in case you are clueless.) I truly tried to educate my kids, my daughter is smart. My son not that much. Talked to him yesterday, he lives in Utah. I doubt he actually has food storage, although I sent him money for food storage under bed, after he went back to college. And get this, we had never mentioned weapons. Well, I told him what I have and mentioned very few in terms of weapons, lots of ammo. He mentioned more weapons and..get ready for this.. TWO (as in one, two) bullets. How did I fail? lol Left over from when he hurt his shoulder while target practicing. He promised to get more. Even prepper with decades of paranoia give birth to clueless children.

    Reply to this comment
    • red May 20, 00:32

      I don’t agree about junk food. We do not give a lot of sugar to kids because they’re sugar freaks, going haywire on just a little. Dried fruit, roasted dried figs (roasting dried fruit brings out the sugar, which is natural, not making them nutty), dried dates, and so on. Dried potato slices have plenty of uses, one of which is to coat with oil and deep-fry for chips. They can be ground to flour or cooked for mashed potatoes, and coated with crushed dried to make tater tots. Hard candy is 3-4 cups sugar, one C water. Honey is much better and less likely to have harmful chemicals or insect infestation (which cannot be seen till the sugar is being eaten by bugs). Very often chemical scrips no longer work. Look up LDS herbals, which can be very extensive and very well researched. We’re fortunate we have an herbalist in the fam. Silver smith! Good idea! I do not have gold, but do go for silver and anything called Irish silver, silver plated over brass. This gives all 3 of the basic anti-bacterial anti-viral metals elders reverenced because they kill diseases. Jerky is not just dried meat! I buy carne seco (dried meat) at the carnisera in Mammoth. It’s raw dried, not cooked. I now have 40 bullets that were given me by neighbors who felt sorry that I had no guns 🙂 Sounds like you son is planning to come home when SHFT. If I may, get him a copy of Wolf and Iron, which explains what happens when civilizations die. niio

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  21. CarmenO May 18, 15:12

    Looking for the comment by Wannabe that says: Thank you for sharing Alfredo… “Just like Puerto Rico and Venezuela everything is hush hush because the left wing mainstream media in America is for the dictatorships in power and don’t want the citizens to have any true coverage.” But can’t find it. There is no “Puerto Rico and Venezuela”. All Puerto Ricans have been US citizens from birth for the last 103 years, and those born before, were all made US citizens 103 years ago. Am I to understand that according to Wannabe the US is a “dictatorship in power”? Puerto Ricans are for the most part REPUBLICANS so they are also targets of the Fake Media. Heck, the only person I know, who liked Obama was my crazy ex-husband (divorced him 40 years ago) and he finally figured out that Democrats are insane, include his former idol. Did Wannabe fall for the Fake Media and decided to delete his post after he used reason? lol

    Reply to this comment
    • Wannabe May 19, 13:02

      Carmen, I’m talking about the disaster that hit them with the hurricane. If I remembere correctly their mayor or governor or whoever was in charge was arrested for not distributing emergency supplies and money to the citizens. There was a lot of aid sent to them and the local authorities were corrupt in not getting it to those in need. And the media cares nothing about reporting on that. Same with Venezuela. A communist poster child for the left and it failed miserably very quickly as well. Where is the coverage???

      Reply to this comment
      • Yosemite May 20, 02:15

        Fox News covered it.
        PR as bankrupt possibly a year or more due to corrupt politicians I o not know their party affiliation. Their as a Terrorist organization I think the FALN or some such name. Hillary got one of the Cop Killers paroled or something like that. The infrastructure as ancient. The complete Power grid had to be rebuilt from the ground up.
        PR was NEVER a Communist or Socialist Nation. Though the terrorists tried and they ultimately failed. Those terrorist threatened Six different US Bases inside the US. I was on one of those bases. Thankfully no attacks happened to any of the bases.

        As far as PR goes it has always supported The US At least From WWII Through Vietnam and until as I type this. The number of them that served Honorably and fought. Shedding and spilling blood sweat limbs and lives makes a statement LOUD AND CLEAR.
        The data is out there to back it up.

        Granted there were people in PR that wanted the US Navy out and an island back that was used as a bomb/weapons range. BUT that was not every citizen. PR Lost a lot of money and jobs when the US Navy pulled out.

        Venezuela used to be a US Ally and friendly to the US. The US got 30-35% of oil from them. It was a very well off Nation and economically sound and prosperous!
        Then Chavez came along and turned the Country around to Socialism and put it on the road to failure..
        .
        Russia stopped Bonehead from leaving! He was on his way out of the Country when the told him not to leave.
        The Venezuela Military is not shooting the Citizens! The Cubans are. ho nos what the 200 or so Russian Military troops are actually doing…….Probably as Bonehead’s Bodyguards and/or “Advisers” to the Cuban troops.

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    • Wannabe May 20, 02:18

      Carmen, I deleted nothing. Puerto Rican’s are dual citizens and do not get the full benefits of constitutional protection unless they move to one of the 52 contingent states of the USA. So they are not entitled to the benefits of this country unless they are willing to forsake their “ homeland” so to speak. They have no voting power in our elections and should not beable to. And as far as I’m concerned we should not ever grant that province state hood because we will have to adopt their third world economy and lift them out of poverty which I am in no way willing to help them out. They need to get off their ass and make things happen to make a thriving economy for themselves. The only thing I can think of is the democrats don’t want them to become a state because most of them are republicans. That matters nothing to me because everyone needs to make a way for themselves much like those who are preppers trying to ensure there is some sort of future for their family if SHTF.

      Reply to this comment
  22. Clergylady May 18, 21:32

    Janie and Jerry.
    My rocket stove is Underwriter Labratory approved for in home use. A family has them made in a small factory. I’m quite pleased with mine. I use a heat activated fan to circulate heat. Right now I have it elsewhere so I’m using a little 7″ fan.
    The stove is gravity fed pellets or take off the hopper and feed it sticks down the long square tube. There is a clean out opening at the front of the fire box and the stove is sent with a handy tool for that purpose.
    It can be vented through the roof or through a wall. Just use the proper insulated pipe for walls or ceilings and roof. I vented mine through the wall. It was just better that way for me.
    It wasn’t cheap but it is multi fuel (pellets, chips, and sticks up to 2″ across) and doesn’t need electricity to operate. I’ve only seen 2 non electric pellet stoves and the other was pellets only. I can burn tiny twigs up to branches 2″ across. That sold me on it. I always have a big pile of branches from trimming trees.
    I’m looking for the website.

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  23. Razman May 18, 21:53

    Okay,,,,I am pretty new to all of this, so I have a question. If the US was struck and an EMP caused all of the damage that they are capable of, and 90 percent of the population dies,,,,,why does anyone think that other nations are not going to step in and own what is left. I seems silly to me to think that predator nations will just give us time to get going again. They will need slaves to carry out the work etc. I watch all of this archaic weapon ideas and laugh,,,,do you really think they are going to not have far superior weapons. We like to say it will be like returning to the 1900s in America. It will, but others will have 2020 weapons and you will be extinct like much of the Native Americans. I believe it America would be looted just as a drug store in Baltimore…………..

    Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper May 19, 03:28

      Razman,
      You make some good points; but, I think underestimate the size of this country. Keeping and holding any territory is a lot harder than you might think, and the logistics of long supply lines make it even harder.
      I would however not want to live in any large city where I am dependent on city services.

      Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck May 19, 06:02

        Ohio Preppier: The Old Breed had a saying, “You don’t own the real estate until you have a Marine with a rifle standing on it.” What you say is quite true. An invasion might well be possible on the east and west coasts, but as soon as you start to get into the western mountains, and I am sure the eastern mountains are similar, having a trooper standing on the real estate is going to get expensive real fast.

        Conquering a large land mass country, as you point out, involves a long supply tail which is always vulnerable to interdiction. Two examples from WWII spring to mind. The Germans in Russia and the Japanese in China. Most westerners don’t realize that WWII started in China in 1931 with the Manchurian Incident, instigated by a rogue Japanese colonel. By the time we got in the war it had been going on in the Pacific for ten years. And that was with the Chinese fighting each other as well as the Japanese. Had the Chinese been able to get together and the many factions attacked the Japanese in concert the U.S. might well not have been involved in any war activity in the Pacific.

        If things are disrupted as much as some seers predict they will be, there won’t be much here for an invader to grab and so everything will have to come across a considerable ocean and then travel overland. Unlike Europe where we had the British Isles to use as a staging area, Greenland doesn’t make that great a staging area for a U.S. invasion. Cuba might, but they are only 90 miles offshore and might well be included in the EMP burst and not much help. The other Caribbean Islands would be in similar straits.

        There are lots of “well, they coulds” but the problems of land mass still present formidable obstacles. It can be done but it might turn out to be a pyrrhic victory.

        Reply to this comment
        • The Ohio Prepper May 21, 14:41

          left coast chuck,

          The Old Breed had a saying, “You don’t own the real estate until you have a Marine with a rifle standing on it.” What you say is quite true. An invasion might well be possible on the east and west coasts, but as soon as you start to get into the western mountains, and I am sure the eastern mountains are similar, having a trooper standing on the real estate is going to get expensive real fast.

          People also need to keep in mind that a deer hunter with a bolt action rifle acting as an insurgent tucked away on a hillside can bring much havoc to those who would try to put their marines on that hill.

          As for the eastern mountains (the Appalachian range). I grew up in them in western Pennsylvania. They were once as majestic as their western counterparts; but, at an age of 480,000,000 years have eroded to less majestic heights.
          The range is about100 to 300 mi wide, running from the island of Newfoundland in Canada, 1,500 mi southwestward to Central Alabama in the US. It’s an old; but, still formidable barrier, inhabited in places by people just as formidable.
          The individual mountains average around 3,000 ft, with the highest of the group at Mount Mitchell in North Carolina at 6,684 feet, which is the highest point in the United States east of the Mississippi River.
          By contrast, the highest point in Ohio which is also the highest point between the Mississippi river and the Appalachians is 26 miles to my west and measures a whopping 1549 feet. LOL.

          Most westerners don’t realize that WWII started in China in 1931 with the Manchurian Incident, instigated by a rogue Japanese colonel. By the time we got in the war it had been going on in the Pacific for ten years.

          So true and I suspect most high school history teachers would not know either, or those who do are not teaching it although perhaps would have at least heard of the Nanjing Massacre or Rape of Nanjing.
          By any practical definition it was an episode of mass murder and rape, both war crimes committed by Imperial Japanese troops against the residents of Nanking. To be completely honest, our oil embargo against Japan in retaliation for that incident was also crucial in starting the war (remember Pearl Harbor) against us.

          If things are disrupted as much as some seers predict they will be, there won’t be much here for an invader to grab and so everything will have to come across a considerable ocean and then travel overland. Unlike Europe where we had the British Isles to use as a staging area, Greenland doesn’t make that great a staging area for a U.S. invasion.

          I think that seers are overestimating the resilience of the people of this country; especially those in rural areas like mine that include hard scrabble “make do” farmers & a considerable Amish population that will barely notice the power outage. An invading expeditionary group will have considerable resources left to savage; but, will also meet, IMHO, considerable armed resistance.

          Cuba might, but they are only 90 miles offshore and might well be included in the EMP burst and not much help. The other Caribbean Islands would be in similar straits.

          The problem with countries like Cuba and those in central & south America, is that they often live a near 3rd world existence with marginal electric power, and like our local Amish, may see the power outage as a mere inconvenience. What those countries could provide an enemy would be bases for staging their assets, closer to the action.

          There are lots of “well, they coulds” but the problems of land mass still present formidable obstacles. It can be done but it might turn out to be a pyrrhic victory.

          No doubt; but, the problem with a pyrrhic victory is that no one from either side wins; unless the whole intent was to decapitate or diminish an enemy, so they could control other regions, like the Chinese and the south china sea. Nothing is ever as simple as one would like.

          Reply to this comment
          • Raven tactical June 17, 19:26

            The deer hunter…. the problem with the deer hunter is be would be unlikey to shoot people without conditioning. Deer hunters engagements vary but most are doing less then 300 meters much Lee’s in most cases 150 or less meters. So at that range you’re kinda in trouble

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    • red May 20, 01:56

      Who’s extinct? Not me, my man. there are tens of thousands of mine alone in Native America. Many more millions of us than are listed as little brown brothers by the DNC. We survive because we’re survivalists, sans the apples and other predators on the People. the average Native American household owns more guns and ammo than the average Texas household. We have very good reason to, what was done before will be done again, as seen in Mexico, how Native Americans were treated. But, thank God for arrogant drug lords and their men always ‘losing’ all those M16s Holder supplied them with. Mexico is beginning to crumble, again, and may wind up better than the US, once the politicians are gone. George Washington had 2 prophecies, published in the mid-1800s, two of which came true. The last one is called black clouds, about this nation being overrun by clouds of people from Asia and N. Africa. The country is wrecked, but the enemy driven off. Those Americans who survive are all gun-owners and know how to use them. Wovoka had similar prophecies, as have had many. But, to cut to the point, if you know how to make black powder, it might help. Ya, but the pharmacist is in his home over the pharmacy and very well-armed. Even in Baltimore. BTW. Word is, there are more illegally owned guns now in the hands of citizens in Baltimore than the hands of criminals.

      If you think warm bodies even with modern weapons can win, you’re wrong. That’s all the invaders have and very few know how to use modern weapons. According to friends from Vietnam, North Vietnam military training: this is a gun. Put the bullets in here. Aim,. Fire. You are now a hero in the grand Army of North Vietnam. All they had was a terror of their officers, Of the forests. Of being mutilated in some way. The archaic weapons that were used were successful. More so than the brand spanking new Chine 56 and AK47 the north bought from the Chinese and USSR. niio

      Reply to this comment
    • Yosemite May 20, 04:19

      Razman
      Not sure where to start so I will start with this:
      The US Revolutionary War Took on a far superior trained and equipped Military and Navy?

      I think you already know who won that one.

      How about the War of 1812? I think you know the answer to that too

      Have you ever heard what the Japanese Admiral said after the attack on Pearl Harbor about awaking a sleeping giant ??
      Or what he or another Senior Japanese Officer said about invading America? There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass. ????

      Ever hear of a little place in Southeast Asia called Vietnam?
      The Vietnamese did not have superior or modern arms….They used Booby Traps to maximum effect and it and run tactics among others and defeated The Worlds only real Super Power at the time. They also had defeated the French before the US got involved.

      Do you know about or are you old enough to remember the Soviet Invasion of Afghanistan???
      GUESS who won that one!
      The Soviets got their asses handed to them on a Platinum platter!
      They had to withdraw and leave Afghanistan with their tail between their legs.

      Any foreign country that wants to take on the US does not have to worry about the US Standing Military troops.

      Do you have any idea how many Combat Veterans are out there?? That know how and have used firearms and killed people and know small unit tactics improvised weaponry?

      Then we have all of the Hundreds of millions firearms out there with hunters alone that out number most any standing army….This does not count people that carry for self defense or go plinking or shoot in competition matches OR any of the CLASS III weaponry owners….Meaning Select Fire and Machine guns and other weapons..

      As for who or what nations would come to aid the US….
      Well besides Japan and German and other European Nations…..No doubt we would be getting help from all over the World.

      The Chinese and Russia both would no doubt be sending aid and Manpower to help rebuild….
      It very well could be the people the send were all soldiers/Military especially from China since they have the troops to spare……Troops and technicians and equipment medicines and food and to put down the Hooligans.

      Look at what the US does when it sends supplies aid where needed….A Lot of Military personnel are invoked and also there to stop looting and keep people safe.
      US Aircraft Carriers have several operating rooms and and an suppl fresh water and hot meals.

      The thing is:
      WHAT are the Preppers going to do??
      and
      HOW are they going to respond?
      HOW will the Preppers be treated?
      HOW will they treat Preppers?
      Live and Let Live???

      Will they start the fight by trying to disarm the Preppers and other survivors that are out there?
      Will they start a fight that will drag every Prepper into it?

      Giving The Russians a chance to retake all of the countries they had before the former USSR and possibly go after all of Europe.

      Do you know what Napoleon said about Morale being a factor in any Battle?

      What about knowing the terrain?

      Americans/Preppers/ Survivors have no place to run to! Our back would be against the wall.
      We have EVERYTHING TO LOSE!
      We Have MOTIVATION TO FIGHT

      We have the advantage of fighting stripping the dead of weapons ammunition or whatever useful items….. but BEWARE of Booby traps or One can Booby trap the bodies for the people they send to recover those bodies.

      It is also possible a version of GPS tracker could possibly be on or in any piece of equipment or gear.
      Something to consider.

      HOPEFULLY Peace will prevail!

      Reply to this comment
      • Raven tactical May 20, 09:58

        Lol…. the French and Dutch were the reason we won the revelationary war. War of 1812 was a military war.

        Afghanistan beat the Russians with the us helping providing stinger missiles. Vietnam was lost because they choose to not fight to win.

        We have vets but that doesnt mean much. The Japanese admiral quote was never said and isnt close to true. Gun ownership is extremely low.

        Reply to this comment
        • Wannabe May 20, 17:21

          Raven, why do you think gun ownership in America is low? I have always heard there are upwards of 350 million weapons in the hands of Americans. Seems pretty high to me. Just wondering your thoughts.

          Reply to this comment
          • Raven tactical May 20, 17:24

            The majority of the guns are owned by roughly 10 percent of the population. Remember the 22lr shortage and how few people had anything stocked up and where crying online and ranting. Gun ownership here is a joke with the majority who have a firearm dont have it zeroed dont have ammo and have taken no effort to train.

            Reply to this comment
      • Raven tactical May 20, 10:02

        Who exactly do you think preppers are ? Most don’t fight but rather homestead. The fight for what. You think your going to get a bunch of them together and take out a unarmored convoy with a few ar15s and smoke grenades.

        Reply to this comment
  24. Tom May 18, 22:30

    To Left Coast Chuck, and Tex,

    My html for this site is not linking me properly, so I can’t answer you directly. I follow the link to your comment, and don’t get your comment, to Left: 1.) Go to YouTube, 2.) Enter the search terms, “Robert,” and, “Sepehr.” He has an extensive library of material. You can find a video on the failed mission of Admiral Byrd to end WWII as well. Read on to my comment to Pretend Texan, Left Coast Tex, to answer another question. I’ll ask this: what would your reaction be if I asked for a bibliography for all the blather you no doubt pontificate from the evening news? My guess: crickets.

    Tex: Hi, There are many videos documenting the legitimacy of Holocaust revision. Good thing we are not in Germany, where Holocaust revisionism or denial is illegal. Now Germany is making European culture illegal to favor the Jewish hating Muslims. I am very supportive of Jewish people, culture, and religion, not so much the criminality that has been carried out in the disguise of Judaism, think Rothschilds, the wealthy families of America who changed their Jewish names and took over America and our culture, the predominantly ‘claiming to be Jewish slave ships, etc. But I digress.
    1.) Look up Holocaust revision to find out facts in that regard, U.S. aerial footage that contradicts Jewish internee’ s claims, evidence of the lack of records of the coke that would have been required, (Germans were meticulous record keepers)…
    2.) The anthropologist, Robert Sepehr, has done much work on these topics. In his videos, you can see the commemorative coin struck in the joint Nazi/ Zionist partnership. I have somewhere a picture of the Henry Ford heir and head of the trusts and foundations receiving the Nazi iron cross. It is well documented that American financiers financially backed Germany.
    3.) Simply do a YouTube search of, “Walmart,” and, “FEMA camps,” to get plenty of footage. You will be barred entry by armed guards, but construction has fallen off drastically once they saw Hillary would not be president. Eyewitness accounts of massive underground vibrations and noise from construction, massive truck traffic. Look up the storage of what are believed to be body containers, farmers are paid to store untold thousands of them. They figure they could hold 10 bodies apiece. Go to the Georgia Guidestones text, you have to read between the lines, when they say they want to maintain a population of 500 million, and we are presently at 7.7 billion, what they are suggesting is they need to eradicate 14 out of every 15 people on earth. My attitude, them first.

    No doubt, you will dismiss everything I say, because I don’t provide you with a detailed bibliography. You sound like one of the acolytes of television propaganda. I bet you couldn’t provide a bibliography for the HORSE! SHIT! that comes out of the mouths of reporters. Facts are coming out that the Steele dossier wad paid for by Hillary’s campaign,  leaked to the press, and the press’s coverage used to get FISA warrants. I am sure I could find your opinions by simply turning on CNN for 5 minutes.

    Reply to this comment
  25. Clergylady May 19, 01:48

    Janie and Jerry you can see the rocket stove that I have at http://www.rocketheater.com
    If you contact my public email ill send pictures of mine and answer questions.
    1clergylady@gmail.com

    Reply to this comment
  26. Clergylady May 19, 01:53

    Janie and Jerry the website is http://wwwrocketheater.com
    Tell them Clergylady sent you.
    If you’d like a picture of my stove or have questions contact my public email
    1clergylady@gmail.com

    Reply to this comment
  27. Tiago Silva May 19, 03:31

    I really agree with that.

    Reply to this comment
  28. The Ohio Prepper May 19, 04:30

    We’ve all found how difficult building a survival stockpile can be. There are so many choices and decisions to make, that it’s easy to take a wrong steer somewhere along the way. Everyone has their own idea of what’s the right stuff to stockpile, and some of those lists seem to contradict each other.

    Can copying and the ”Eat what you store and store what you eat” has always worked for us, while also looking for bargains on long term storage and freeze dried foods.
    One good inexpensive long term easy to prepare food is the Mylar package soup mixes from Bear Creek.

    One piece of dangerous advice that’s floating around the internet is to stockpile what your family likes to eat. I say that is dangerous, because most of our families don’t eat all that healthy. So, if we stockpile what they eat as survival food, we may have an awful lot of bulk, without a whole lot of nutrition. We might also find that we have a lot of frozen food, without any way of keeping it frozen.

    I don’t think this is dangerous; and is what we have done; but, it does make assumptions that everyone eats crap. That make sense of all you watch is the MSM, who focus on obesity and disease, since that catshes eyeballs and clicks; but, rarely shows the true story.
    Junk Food
    Can you define junk food please? Some think that a sandwich using white bread fits the definition and Vegans eschew all animal products. To some Vegans, even honey exploits the bees.
    Frozen Food
    We have a lot of frozen foods, primarily meat, since we purchase our beef from a local farmer by the quarter or half. That beef cost us $2.90 per pound. While that’s a little expensive for bones; it’s pretty good for 95% ground beef and great for steaks and roasts.
    We have a whole house generator to keep the freezer and both refrigerators running as well as power the well pump and sump pump.
    We have enough propane and consumables on hand to run the generator for at least 10 months.
    Medicines with Short Shelf Lives
    We have nothing in that category and the only one I have to have</strong) is aspirin; but, the Allopurinol would be important for gout mitigation.

    There is no reliable guide for how long medicines will actually last. The only thing you can do is to run your own tests. That can be risky, especially in the case of drugs which are needed to sustain people with chronic conditions.

    The only medication I know of that is dangerous when used after its expiration date is Tetracycline that can damage the kidneys. Others could potentially be ineffective.
    Electronics

    I know a lot of people who are stockpiling electronics, with the idea that an EMP is going to take out the electronics that they use every day. Just think about that for a moment. If an EMP takes out your electronics, then what are those people going to use the cell phones, radios and other devices they are stockpiling with? Who is going to be on the other end?

    As a ham operator heavily involved in emergency communications, I have quite a few radios with various capabilities with lots of other operators on the other end. I also have some that could be handed out to a team or individuals without their own equipment.
    Gold & Silver
    I have some of each as a hedge; but, brass and copper might be better, or just plain copper, as in wire.

    Here’s a controversial one for you; gold and silver. Most people say that you should stockpile these precious metals for use in an economy where the dollar no longer works. But and this is a very big but, what makes them think that there will be any economy to use that gold and silver in, if the dollar is no longer working?
    Any fiat currency and that includes gold and silver are simply liquid barter or a known value store of wealth. In history it has been wampum (sea shells) and tulip bulbs; but, often just a barter ledger works for a small community. You have tons of wheat and I have eggs; but, you don’t need all of my eggs nor I all of your wheat, so some intermediary method of keeping track is required. In the ancient Minoan civilization, surviving writing is mainly that used for accounting. Tablets serving as labels, with the impression of the side of a wicker basket on the back, and tablets showing yearly summaries, suggest a sophisticated accounting system.
    Basically if you cannot wear it or eat it, it is generally a luxury, and non luxury necessities would win out every time.
    Excessive Weapons & Ammunition
    Excessive firearms, maybe; but, ammunition, never. What I have done is acquire firearms with common cartridges / shells to make my ammunition inventory count. I for instance have two 9 mm handguns and a 9 mm rifle. I have numerous ways to shoot 20 gauge and .410 vore shotguns along with others for the common .22
    Power Tools

    Now, this one may not seem like something you’d stockpile; but I’ve seen it done. I’ve actually run into a couple of different people who were stockpiling power tools for use in a post-disaster world. When I asked them about electrical power, they showed me their generator. Then, when I asked them about gasoline, they pointed to the gas tank, which I thought was probably filled with old gas.

    I use the Ryobi ONE+ system for numerous power tools. I can recharge those batteries from my generator (with tons of propane fuel) or from one of several small solar systems.

    The thing is, any of us can apply this same sort of faulty logic to just about anything. While there is always room for new ideas in the prepping and survival community, we need to make sure that our ideas fit into a realistic scenario. Otherwise, all we’re going to do is spend time and effort investing in something that’s not going to do us the least bit of good.

    As a retired engineer who has been prepping for more than 40 years, I understand faulty logic where wishes replace realistic analysis. My spreadsheets often help planning for both time & money expenses.
    One should establish a need for an item and fit it into the budget, not purchase the item and try to justify it.

    Reply to this comment
  29. Clergylady May 19, 07:52

    Left Coast Chuck I have a hunch an invader would find the same problem here that the British found in what we call the Revolutionary War… The locals refused to march out and die onquest wou l d in ranks like trained soldiers were expected to. Folks here shot from around trees and bolders. It was a war of ambush and stealth. An enemy you can’t see is still hard to shoot.
    We could be out manned but hopefully not easily outsmarted. We are so scattered and the land so large conquest should be a logistical nightmare. And for now anyway we are an armed populace. À

    Reply to this comment
  30. tweell May 19, 16:21

    A lot of this is good stuff, but I’ll still stash hard candy and junk silver. Hard candy has an indefinite storage life, and would make decent bartering material. Empty calories, sure, but sometimes you need calories.
    Junk silver is for the semi-SHTF event, such as the Depression. At the start of the Depression, my family had a large farm and were able to produce most of what they needed. By WWII, they were in a small house in town. The farm had been sold off in sections to pay taxes, at pennies on the dollar.
    I don’t like gold, because of the same reason. FDR took everyone’s gold, and what the government has done once, they can do again. Grandpa kept a few gold coins, but couldn’t spend them anywhere, so finally had them made into jewelry which he then sold, getting ripped off in the process.
    Remember that death and taxes are the two things that we cannot avoid. Plan for both.

    Reply to this comment
  31. Clergylady May 20, 02:10

    Tweel. My mother saved a few gold pieces and old coins. In the 1980s she gave them to me. I sold them and drilled a well and bought the pump and pressure tank et. The rest was a down payment on a much needed car. It was sad that so many lost their money when Gold was confiscated. I was quite surprised that Mom had kept some and saved it all those years.

    Reply to this comment
  32. Aladin Darkness May 23, 09:49

    I told a guy I was stock piling hand tools.
    He said he was too, and pointed to a bunch of power tools.
    Power tools are not hand tools.
    Idiots…

    Reply to this comment
  33. The NPP June 17, 19:19

    Honestly? I think prepping is a hobby with some people. It explains the excesses and the types of prepping.
    When my hobby was comic books, I kept more than I could ever read.
    Same with weapons. Recently saw a rack of some 20+ fishing poles. WHY? You can’t fish with more than 4 at a time.
    Oh well.

    Reply to this comment
    • The Ohio Prepper June 18, 01:22

      The NPP,

      Honestly? I think prepping is a hobby with some people. It explains the excesses and the types of prepping.

      I could not agree more.
      I think many people ”pretend”>/strong> to prep to justify expenditures for firearms, and other gadgets they just want to have.
      In 1996 I was involved in a preparedness expo aimed primarily at the upcoming Y2K non-event.
      There was a long line to pay something like $180.00 for one of the new Baygen radios, that was one of the first multi-powered
      ”Emergency” radios. It’s a neat radio with a wind-up spring generator, a solar panel, and an external power connection; but, was not worth that high price to me.
      I was standing near the line talking with some of the people and asking why they were getting the radio, and got several answers including the halting of all computers due to Y2K and of course the inevitable EMP. For both of those events, I explained to them that the grid would be down, and that radio stations powered from the grid, which is most of them, would not be able to transmit, and then asked them what they would be listening to. Several people got that horrible “I didn’t think of that” look on their faces; but, then dutifully got back in line to wait their turn for a new toy.
      I have one of those radios I purchased at the local Odd Lots store for $20.00 about a year later.

      Reply to this comment
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