Will the Liberals or the Conservatives Start a Civil Unrest?

Giurgi C.
By Giurgi C. June 5, 2018 07:30

Will the Liberals or the Conservatives Start a Civil Unrest?

Editor’s Note: This article is written by Giurgi C. and does not necessarily reflect this website’s options and beliefs, but it portrays some scenarios that are likely to happen.

Prepping is a safeguard against a whole range of possible scenarios, and everyone has their own opinions about what’s most likely to happen and what would be the biggest threat. There’s one thing pretty much everyone can agree on, though, and that’s that widespread civil unrest is going to bring on a social collapse, at least in the affected areas and maybe right across the country.

Who’s likely to cause this civil unrest, though? Does anyone have the ability to throw large parts of the USA into chaos? We’ve all seen often enough how local issues can spark unrest in a neighborhood or even a small city, but could the same happen on the scale of a county, a state, the whole Midwest or Atlantic seaboard?

Yes it could, and the most likely way it’s going to happen is that some incident upsets politically active people – not just in the town where it happens, but across the state or the country – so much they decide enough is enough, and try to bring about a radical change. That’s happened hundreds of times throughout history, in all sorts of countries – and while the USA is unique in many ways, it’s not unique enough to be immune from the threat of mass civil unrest.

Experts don’t argue about whether unrest could happen in the USA. It could; that’s a done deal. What they do argue about is where it’s most likely to come from. Any part of the political spectrum can be pushed into rebellion but for that to happen to the majority who’re pretty much in the center, things really have to be bad. More usually, when unrest happens it comes from either the right or left. It doesn’t always come from people who could be labeled as extremists either – often it’s people who’re identifiably to one side of center, but not particularly hard line.

Left or Right: Who Wants to Fight?

Listen to anyone on the left and they’ll tell you that the biggest threat of civil unrest comes from heavily armed groups on the “far right” or “alt right”. On the other hand, speak to anyone on the right and they will say that the real danger is the organized and violent flash mobs of Antifa and other “far-left” groups. Are they both correct, or is one – even both – wrong?

There’s no doubt that left and right both have extremes who’re more than willing to use violence. There aren’t a lot of them on either side though, so it’s unlikely they could directly cause widespread civil unrest. What they might be able to do is cause enough trouble to provoke a backlash from the mainstream on the other side, and that really could become civil unrest.

Thanks to the media it’s right-wing extremists who get the most attention, but in fact their numbers are every small. There are neo-Nazi and white supremacist groups in the USA, but most of them are tiny and too disorganized to cause any serious trouble. There have been lone wolf terrorists on the American far right, with Timothy McVeigh being the most notorious. They’re sometimes capable of committing serious atrocities, but mass civil unrest is beyond them.

Left-wing extremists are more numerous, unfortunately. The largest extreme left group in the USA right now is Antifa – but, with an estimated 15,000 hardcore members, even Antifa isn’t big enough to create civil unrest at a national level. Law enforcement could put down an Antifa uprising inside a couple of days. The far left might not like that, but it’s still a fact.

Related: America’s Vulnerability When it Comes to Internal Crises: US Now vs. US Then

The mainstream menace?

But what about the mainstream left – the tens of millions of Americans who see themselves as on the left of the spectrum, but reject extremist positions like Marxism? Could they reduce the country to chaos? Yes, they could.

Mainstream leftists don’t have the enthusiasm for violence that groups like Antifa are notorious for, but they do have an endless appetite for getting involved in causes. Any perceived “injustice”, from border control to employment policies, is likely to attract a horde of protesting lefties. Usually nothing much happens beyond legitimate political protest, but sometimes things can get out of control.

If there’s a large protest movement, and its members feel they’re not being taken seriously, tempers can rise. If the people who’re getting angry are well enough organized this is where civil unrest can break out – and the problem is that large parts of the left are very well organized. This end of the political spectrum is closely linked to labor unions and a large, interlocking network of pressure groups; they’re very good at spreading messages, exploiting social media and getting people mobilized.

Many on the left also don’t have a lot of respect for the society we live in. They would like to see it “reformed” into something that fits their ideas better, and this attitude makes it easy for them to justify breaking the law. That’s why left-wing protests are prone to violence and looting; if everything you see around you is a symbol of oppression and inequality, it’s tempting to lash out.

The mainstream right is a bit different. It’s nothing like as well organized, for a start. The vast majority of right-of-center Americans aren’t actually very interested in politics, because they’re focused on work and family. When right-wingers do get annoyed about a political issue they’re less likely to do anything about it, for the same reason – they’re busy getting on with their lives.

On the other hand, if the right do get pushed hard enough that they decide to take action, they’re a lot more capable of creating some serious unrest. A lot of that is down to the simple fact that the right have more guns than the left, and tend to know how to use them. Any large, heavily armed, combat-effective insurgency in the USA would pretty much have to come from the right; the left just don’t have many people with those sort of skills.

Related: Surviving Martial Law: What To Do If It Hits Your Town

Where’s the danger?

Both liberals and conservatives have the potential to create mass civil unrest if they decide they want to. That shouldn’t be a surprise; people are people, whatever they believe, and while some belief systems seem to encourage violence in their followers any of us can be pushed to rebellion by the right factors.

If conservatives rose up that would be more disruptive, and more dangerous to the government. Firstly, conservatives are more heavily armed; secondly they have an inbuilt respect for law and order, so for them to start overthrowing society they have to be very angry.

Realistically, though, the political left is the main threat when it comes to civil unrest. They’re organized, they get upset easily and there are a lot of them. Most unrest in western countries is caused by leftist groups, and the USA Is just as vulnerable as anywhere else. Our citizens might be better armed to protect themselves, but mass action by the left could still tear society apart in a hurry. If that happens, all the systems we rely on in everyday life will soon fall apart across the whole area affected by the disorder – and, unless you’re prepared for that, you’re in for a pretty hard time.

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Giurgi C.
By Giurgi C. June 5, 2018 07:30
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  1. Hoosier Homesteader June 5, 12:25

    DON’T get me started!!! 🙂
    …why can’t we all just get along???

    Reply to this comment
    • wa2qcj June 5, 13:16

      That would be the best option, for all of us to just get along. That said, the left is sure they are right, they see conservatism as an enemy to be destroyed, and will follow that dictate. They see social issues as the fault of conservatives, the lack of plenty for all, now, and see conservatives as the cause of this. What they fail in, is consideration for the way many conservatives live. Many are little or no better off than those that the left see as being set aside and their needs ignored. If “you” are not for us, you are against us is their point of view. The idea of “how dare you have a job, and plenty to eat” that came from obama is a rally cry for them. They do not see themselves as being in the same position as that which they deplore, as having a job, and plenty to eat, themselves. Whom do I think will set off the anticipated violence, the left. They are itching to make their point, and drive home their agenda. If that wrecks the country in the process, well, “the others” made them do it. Self control, and self discipline are not concepts that they wish to demonstrate. Once it begins, however, expect to see many conservatives rise up with a violence and energy that will be totally unexpected. The left seem to think they have the upper hand and setting things right will be very simple. They might even take over many cities in the process. However, water and food supplies are brought to the cities, not produced in the cities, for the most part. Cities are a “sponge”. If there is no “water” for the sponge to absorb, it goes dry, and gets hard. We all would be a lot better off, to just, as you say, get along, and stop the bickering.

      Reply to this comment
      • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 00:30

        From my viewpoint, and I’m no expert, there are three issues that the Left seem to gravitate to: 1) Want for Power, 2) Envy, because they don’t have all the Power they believe they should have, 3) Greed, because so many of the Left hate Conservatives because of our work ethic and what we have done for ourselves, mostly on our own, without assistance from Entitlement Programs.
        Everybody’s problem, … everybody’s, is our fallen state. This won’t change until the One who spoke a word and the universe came into existence returns and makes things right. Until then, I’m going to do my duty as a law abiding citizen, influence those who are within my reach, and try the best I can to get along with everyone.

        Reply to this comment
      • Wishful thinking June 6, 02:26

        Have you recently sat down and really talked with a liberal? I think you might find that we agree on more than we disagree. The media, including social media, are trying to get us to take sides and become more and more tribal and less civil towards each other because that makes for more dramatic coverage and more hits on social media. As an unabashed liberal I believe in freedom of speech — even speech I don’t agree with as long as someone isn’t advocating violence or hatefully threatening others. I believe in self-sufficiency and growing my own food, not asking for handouts. I was raised on a farm and was taught to work hard and value education and tolerance. However, I don’t mind sharing with those in need; in fact, I believe it is my moral duty. I distrust authoritarian leadership and bullies. I think people should be free to do as they please as long as they aren’t harming others. The government should stay out of my personal business. I distrust the excessive surveillance in our society. I believe everyone should pay their fair share of taxes and those taxes should be spent frugally. Do you know it costs $100 million for one F-35? $35,000 an hour to operate an F-35? I served in the military for 10 years and love my country, but the military is wasteful — it’s a difference kind of welfare. You can question this type of spending and still be patriotic. I don’t hate anyone. I love reading about prepping, it just makes sense to me. So, I’m asking you all, am I going to start this leftist unrest? Not me or anyone I care about is lusting for power, envy or greed — these characteristics aren’t partisan.

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 6, 03:53

          I really like what you have to say, Wishful thinking. You have a really good head on your shoulders. There are SO many good people on just this one page and even though I’m Canadian ( and proud of it, eh? LOL!) I have more in common with many on this page than not. There are still good people left in the world and that DOES give me hope for the future.

          Reply to this comment
          • Jim December 23, 14:57

            I am a retired disabled veteran (USAF1980-2000). I am also a Blue Dog Democrat. I switched parties when Democrats were supporting veterans issue while Republicans would complain about how much reform would cost. I heard someone say the difference between Democrats and Republicans was very simple. Republicans look at America as a son looks at his parents. He respects their values and doesn’t want to change anything about them. Democrats on the other hand, look at America like a mother looks at her children. She wants them to experience as much and as great as they can and his willing to do anything so that future can be realized. Both want America to be great, but their methods are different.

            Reply to this comment
            • J David December 23, 19:52

              As a former Democtat I have found a very distinctive difference. Democrats want everyone to live according to their standards. If not by choice then by force. Conservatives feel like people should live the way they choose. They don’t necessarily agree with your life style but it’s your life.
              It is really about that simple.

              Reply to this comment
        • Miss Kitty June 6, 06:34

          Wishful, I used to be a lot further left than I am now. Can’t really put a finger on what changed my mind, but the vitriol and hypocrisy on the part of MSM and party leaders like Clinton, Pelosi, et al really cemented it for me. You sound like good people and like you can think for yourself. Thanks for your grace and honesty.

          Reply to this comment
        • kerry keel June 6, 06:51

          Wishful Thinking, are you really, really sure about being Liberal? You sound more conservative Republican than you do Liberal. You are right, for those who think as you do, conservatives are closer to what you espouse than you may realize. Your comment on cost of aircraft, yes, the military is wasteful, I agree. Part of that cost is good old fashioned greed by politicians, and the industry leaders. On a closer to home look at expense, a semiconductor that my equipment needs, I can get it for $0.51 from Newark Element14. The Federal Logistics cost, which we are generally forced to use, that part costs $51.17. To me, that is outrageous. Government, if you want to save money, quit spending high dollars on low cost parts.

          Reply to this comment
        • Midwest transplant June 6, 10:55

          Wishful thinking,this country is being divided,but not by the people but by the media,there is an agenda on both sides.I call myself a conservative and I value your opinion as one that I share.I am a first born american my father had no more than an elementary school education who instilled in me a work ethic,we would have been considered lower middle class and as all parents want better for their children mine did also,knowing that I needed to work I joined the labor force after high school.My career spanned over 45 years as now I’m retired a (baby boomer).Growing up we were sometimes on commodity food when times were hard but still we had dignity,my parents taught me to treat others as you would want to be treated,I remember watching on the tv the Watts race riots I didn’t understand what was happening then,but I do now.Inequality because of the color of your skin is a travesty, one we should all be ashamed of,will it change?What can we do,working together,side by side is the only solution,just as the world was united by a common goal(WWll) to rid us of evil by people that were determined to make the world as they saw fit,there will always be some who sees themselves better than others,and until Jesus Christ returns the world will be in chaos.The solution change one life at a time,God gives the opportunity we just have to be willing to step out of our comfort zone.

          Reply to this comment
        • Hacksaw June 6, 13:16

          Wishful Thinking. At some point in your life, usually around age 30, you will mature and realize that you are a conservative. Don’t believe me? Review your post. It’s chock full of conservative talking points. Hard work? Not a liberal position. Liberals support welfare and food stamps. Conservatives work for a living. Freedom of speech? Liberals have demonstrated that we are all free to speak as long as it is speach that liberals agree with.UC Berkeley and their out right ban of non liberal speakers is real evidence of the liberals desire to filter all speech. Govt should stay out of your business? Another conservative value. Less govt is the best govt. liberals want to micromanage every second of every life. Conservatives practice self responsibility. No lust for power? Another conservative value. The Clintons, Chuck Schumer Nancy Pelosi. All consumed by their lust for power. Value Education? All Conservatives value education as a means for Improving life. Liberals view education as a tool to control lives. If you are beyond the age of 30 then you are beyond grasping conservative values and are doomed to a life of liberalism.

          Reply to this comment
        • Hoosier Homesteader June 7, 11:23

          Wishful, by the way you describe yourself, you appear to be a conservative. If all liberals had your beliefs, we’d be better off.
          And glancing at the Main Stream Press, most of what I see has a slant toward envy, greed, and a lust for power.

          Reply to this comment
        • MikeyW June 7, 17:21

          If you believe what you say you believe, you are not a liberal – at least, not a modern liberal. You are a libertarian. You sound like you would have no problem supporting Rand Paul, or other conservative Republicans. If you are still voting Democrat, you are voting against your own principles. I’ve found that many people who are Democrats because their families have always been Democrats actually hold more conservative views and would be much more comfortable as Republicans if they looked at which party more closely espouses the principles they believe in, rather than just party labels.

          Reply to this comment
        • eagle June 8, 20:19

          Well said but you described yourself as more conservative than liberal.
          You would make the kind of neighbor I would like to have.

          Reply to this comment
        • JakeTP July 9, 18:19

          WISHFUL If those are your beliefs I don’t know how you call yourself a Liberal but that’s fine. I do agree that it is the media and the ruling elitists that are pulling the strings and keeping us arguing. Divide and Conquer. I have on many occasions tried to discuss politics and differences with Liberals and it always ends up the same way. It is my fault that the conversations stop as I have a very, very low tolerance for stupidity. Let me explain. I have no problem with differences of opinion, policy or beliefs but somewhere in each and every discussion the liberal will say something like…. Obama (or Hillary) really seems to care about people, or Democrats are for the poor and middle class and Republicans only support the rich, or All Republicans are racist, or anyone of a number of things about the 2nd amendment. I won’t list all of the stupid things I have heard. Some of these people have been highly educated but once a person says something stupid I have no desire to continue talking to them and it has happened nearly every time.
          Yes I normally do tell them that I am done because of their stupid comment.

          Reply to this comment
    • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 15:23

      The conservatives DO NOT WANT to GET ALONG.

      The conservatives want Group-Think. The conservatives insists that everyone think like them.

      The conservatives want to kill leftists, Democrats, socialists, LBGQ, freethinkers etc.

      The conservatives WANT A WAR. What else are they going to do with all their guns.

      Reply to this comment
      • Arizona Survivor June 5, 15:57

        You are uninformed and full of bovine excrement.

        Reply to this comment
        • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 16:05

          Not a proper comment. Please review and say something responsible.

          Reply to this comment
          • Looking for Learning June 5, 18:13

            Sadly, you are uninformed and a response would fall on deaf ears to someone who writes, “Please review and say something responsible.” It is an utter waste of time to an individual who perceives themselves to be omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent. While that definition is only true of the Creator of the Universe, self aggrandizement such as yours —is your only line of defense between the paradigm of your fantasized reality and the true reality the rest of us populate.

            Reply to this comment
          • Redbonejohn June 5, 22:48

            He did. You just too stupid to understand.

            Reply to this comment
          • MATURE PRepper June 6, 01:43

            Jeansandjackctrequirred. BACKWARDS,,,YOU FOOL.

            Reply to this comment
            • kerry keel June 6, 06:50

              Indeed, this is agreed upon. What many do not realize is that the democrats started, and protected the kkk. Consider where the kkk did it’s work, in the south. Where was the democrat party the strongest, in the south. To be a good loyal southerner, you were a democrat. It was expected of you. As a democrat, you felt the kkk was doing the right things. Now, the socialist democrats want us to believe the kkk belonged to someone else. As usual, they prey on ignorance, and keep the turmoil going. The number one best thing anyone can do is, ignore these people, and think for yourself. Search everything out, come to your own conclusions. If anyone says, think this way, ignore them. Being reasoned with is one thing, an effort made to force you to think a certain way is very much different, and best avoided.

              Reply to this comment
              • jeansandjacketrequired June 7, 06:33

                Learn your current History. KKK was largely democrat people in the South who hated and murdered Blacks and Catholics OVER 100 YEARS AGO!!!

                OVER 100 YEARS AGO!!!

                With the success of the civil rights movement in the 1950-60s the SOUTH and the KKK switch their alliance to the Republicans.

                KKK today hates Blacks and are throughly Republican and Conservative.

                Reply to this comment
                • kerry keel June 7, 13:43

                  I wouldn’t call the 60’s as being 100 years ago. The KKK was still very much active into the 70’s, albeit not as strongly as in previous decades. The KKK was, indeed, Democrat people. The south was deeply embedded with the Democrat party until their values changed. The so called KKK may now want to be aligned with the Republicans, but they are not wanted by anyone. They are pariahs that no one in their right mind wants anything to do with. As to your emphasis on 100 years ago, you are exaggerating. 100 years ago would put that to the 1918 time frame, and the KKK was VERY much active then. Foolish people, who have little sense of what is right or wrong perpetuate hatred without cause. Be they members of the kkk, or some other back water group that has their mind wrapped around finding someone to blame for everything are, and will remain fringe groups that people look at with disdain. You don’t have to be a member of the kkk or some other fringe group, that are known and watched by law enforcement, albeit there are some of those that are part of those fringe groups themselves, to be a foolish hater of any group of people. Those who value humans for the sake that they are just that, humans, and creations of God, seek to live in peace with everyone. Personally, if I had my way, these people who hate blacks, and might need a blood transfusion, would be denied that treatment. Why, because a Black doctor discovered blood typing, which makes safe transfusions possible. Our society and the world owes much to that man, and others like George Washington Carver for their bountiful discoveries and inventions that make our society better than what it was before. Like the cotton gin, a black man discovered that, but Eli Whitney got the credit. The inventor was a slave, and they were not allowed to receive such credit, then. Something I find deplorable. Rant as you do, and say what you believe is correct, but remember that as you do, there are people older than you are and have experienced more in life than you have. Opinions, as the saying goes, are like noses, everyone has them. Balanced perspective, however, is in short supply. I think your perspective is very much out of balance, and leans in a negative direction in which you are quick to judge, based on to little information.

                  Reply to this comment
            • jeansandjacketrequired June 7, 06:28

              Anyone who so stupid as to think the KKK are Liberal has got their britches on backward and their tin-foil hat on much too tight. LOL. You have been played by Conservative Lying pundits Mature Prepper.

              I do feel sorry for you.

              Reply to this comment
        • Proudly Deplorable June 5, 18:37

          Well said. You have memorized the Communist playbook perfectly. You’re a good Useful Idiot.

          Reply to this comment
        • Mature prepper June 6, 01:34


          Reply to this comment
      • farmer June 5, 16:27

        May I suggest Prozac.

        Reply to this comment
      • freelancer1 June 5, 17:07

        I have to admit …your true colors sure came out just now ……you also seem to forget what youer forefathers fought and died for ..the freedom you are now expressing

        Reply to this comment
      • Jeff June 5, 17:09

        I’m a conservative, I wish everyone can get along. we all have the rights to our opinions and beliefs, I don’t care if you believe what I do, that’s the lefts rights, an that’s the same for me. There is a middle that’s between both the left and right, and the middle is what is coming between the right and left, I pray that both sides will see this, then, maybe then we all can come together and put a stop to the division.

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 6, 04:03

          When it comes right down to it, Jeff, there is no left nor right. Ideologically speaking. It’s an artificial construct and in the greater scheme of things totally irrelevant. At it’s most basic, no matter where we live, or who we are, we are all citizens of this world. We are all the same. We all want the same things. We all have the same needs and desires. All these political differences. Do they really matter or are they also artificial constructs designed to keep us divided. Is any one country any better than any other country? Is any one person any better or any more important than any other? Truly?

          Reply to this comment
      • Kdms June 5, 17:12

        This comment is about as stupid as the leftist can be. If the extreme Right wanted to kill Leftist, they would, it’s that simple. However who are the ones that attack and start confrontations? The Leftist, at every level from middle left to extreme leftist! Get your facts straight.

        Reply to this comment
      • Sgt Al June 5, 18:51

        The perfect example of the frying pan calling the kettle black!!!

        Reply to this comment
      • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 00:34

        Jeansandjacketarerequired …Conservatives can say the same about Liberals. Think about that.

        Reply to this comment
      • Mature prepper June 6, 01:35


        Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty June 6, 06:10

        Where DO you get this nonsense from? We’ve had conservatives in office before and much better strength, and there were no mass murders of lgbt , blacks, Hispanics, socialists, Democrats, etc. Whoever told you that was lying. Period. Do some independent research and draw an educated conclusion – don’t believe ANYONE’S word for unsubstantiated crap like that steaming pile of hate. Somebody is using you, J&J. You’ve been played.

        Reply to this comment
      • kerry keel June 6, 06:46

        We do not want others FORCING their views on us. We do not like kids being used as sex toys. If a boy can have sex with a boy, and produce children from that, then they have a legitimate union. If not, they are not a legitimate union. That is based on good old science. We believe science to be right, leftist want science to be perverted to agree with their out of control idea. Yes many of us have weapons, that is for protection from the leftist nut jobs.

        Reply to this comment
      • Hacksaw June 6, 13:32

        Jeans – you are obviously a product of government controlled education. The brain washing is strong within your feeble liberal mind. Conservatives want to kill? I’m conservative and I have no desire to kill anyone or anything. I even capture insects in my home, office, car and let them go because I abhor killing anything. So you LIE when you claim that conservatives want to kill. Open your eyes and you will see the violence from the left. ANTIFA. When was the last time they conducted anything peaceful? BlackLivesMatter? How much violence erupts every time these people get together ? Thanks for proving what every sane rational self responsible person knows about the left: a bunch of lying, hateful violent instigators. Your lies do not fly here in realville and your post indicates that you do not have the intelligence to last 5 seconds in a survival situation.

        Reply to this comment
      • Cordobas Revenge June 7, 01:27

        what a free thinker ?

        Reply to this comment
      • DaveM June 7, 16:26

        definitely are a leftist! Your view of life is skewed by following others with no common sense or reasoning power All those whom you have stated, except conservatists, are interested in what they can get rather than contribute and become part of a solution. You need to reflect upon what you have written. If you still see that you are headed the right way in your opinion…I will be glad to be the Conservative you have stated falsely. To me it will be one person less to destroy my country!

        Reply to this comment
      • J David December 23, 19:58

        I assume you are just trying to get a ride out of folks because everything you said is very true of the Democrat Socialist party.

        Reply to this comment
    • Armin June 5, 18:55

      It would be nice, HH, wouldn’t it? But that would mean that ALL of us being able to accept and respect each other for who and what we all are. It doesn’t look like people are built like that. We’re too competitive. We all want too much. The keeping up with the Jones’s syndrome. There’s something wrong with us if we’re at least not as good as our neighbours. And then there are those that want what others have. Whether it’s their possessions. Their wives. Their homes. Their cars. And think nothing of doing whatever it takes to get what the other has. And then we get into the human condition. The dysfunctional. The psychotic. The misanthrope. I don’t know if we’ll ever get to the point when there’s no more conflict on this planet. I have a splinter in mind that won’t give me peace. I have this almost compulsion to want to know things. This may sound strange but it’s almost like we’re being goaded into a certain course of action against our will and our better judgement. Action by the many to benefit the few.

      Reply to this comment
      • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 00:47

        Armin, I’m with you. I have a need to learn. Without that, I feel incomplete.
        Disagreement, on both sides, is the human side of us coming out; Conservatives believe they’re right, and Liberals believe they’re right.
        Until we can grasp Respect, and do the hardest, yet paradoxically the simplest thing in the world, Forgive, I fear nothing will change.

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 6, 03:45

          Maybe you’ve hit the nail right on the head, HH. Respect for self. Respect for others. Forgiveness for self. Forgive others. Maybe it IS as simple as that and paradoxically as difficult because then we get into acceptance and unconditional love. I’m not particularly religious but I still remember the Lord’s prayer and I believe in there it does say something about forgiving the transgressions of others. I remember starting each school day with reciting the Lord’s Prayer. I don’t think it did us any harm. From that we have some kind of a solid base which others may be missing. No one is perfect and as long as we can acknowledge our own faults we can also accept others with all their warts and wrinkles. Once we accept our own failings we can work to improve ourselves and maybe help others to do the same. I once posited the analogy that we’re all on a different rung of a huge ladder. We’re here to help boost that person above us even higher as the person below us is supposed to do the same thing for us. Sadly, some will never understand nor accept that concept.

          Reply to this comment
        • kerry keel June 6, 06:48

          I agree. That said, there are groups that feel left out, that they are being unfairly restrained. That is more true than anyone realizes. It is also very likely that those who feel one group wants another group restrained, in actuality, both have the same goals. The people that all people need to ignore are those who try to stir up dissent and anger in any group to another group. That means that those who stand to gain from making trouble with anyone, or any group, needs to be ignored. A common ground is our mutual advancement, and attaining desired goals for a better life. Making, or trying to make someone else pay for past issues gets no one anywhere.

          Reply to this comment
          • Armin June 6, 19:27

            I like what you say, Kerry, and you’ve said it better than I ever could. Our common ground SHOULD be our mutual advancement and trying to make life better for everyone by working together towards a common goal. If only everyone could be on board about it. Unfortunately there will always be detractors and they sour the milk. So to speak. The past is the past and it can’t be changed. The only thing we can do is to try and make the best future for everyone that we can. Are we here to try and help and educate each other as much as we can or are we here to drag each other down and kill as many of our fellow humans as possible?

            Reply to this comment
    • judy June 6, 02:23

      I grew up in a small Texas town that is 65% Republican. Our population is 19% black and 8% Hispanic. I know a hundred or so people I have grown up with and know they are good people. I am a good person. We all go to church most of the time. I vote Democratic most of the time because I follow the idea that we are our brother’s keepers and all our brothers don’t look just like us. I have black friends I count on for lots of things. I have Hispanic friends that teach me a whole lot about work, and cooking, and caring for others. Some fine people I know are married gay men who took a deserted baby to raise when his white drug addict mother left him with multiple handicaps from her addictions. I think God will welcome them with open arms even though their church does not. The people I know are good; some are liberal; some are conservative. When we talk about what we want for our life and our children’s lives, we are right together. When we jump on an ideology that seeks to make another believe as we do, and failing that, get mad: our peace is rendered asunder. So, I always ask. What are we fighting for..abortion or no abortion; SNAP or no SNAP; medical insurance or no medical insurance. Why do we make ideas the downfall of our love for people we have known and worked with all our lives. Only the radical and the noisy. I won’t change you if you won’t change me. We have walked different paths. but we are headed the same way. Feel free to republish this.;

      Reply to this comment
      • rebelgray June 18, 06:03

        Judy, If You think God is going to welcome gay men raising children that are orphaned or abanded,please read the 1st chapter of Romans in the Bible.

        Reply to this comment
  2. marten June 5, 13:32

    The Left, no matter the country, has always been extremely vocal and “out there”. If you look back at the Russian Revolution, it was a small group of leaders who brought an unhappy populace to its feet and overthrew an unpopular form of government.
    In the US, the government, as a whole, is not necessarily unpopular although everyone, Left and Right, likes to rail on changes that should be made. I personally don’t care about the elected politicians as wacko as some may be. The unelected bureaucracy is what bothers me because they write bills, laws, rules and regulations that infringe upon you daily. You don’t even know those laws are there until some bureaucrat decides to enforce them.

    Reply to this comment
    • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 17:24

      You are correct about the Russian Revolution. It is amazing how forward and backward that country was 100+ years ago.

      But you cannot equate Russians with Americans. We have completely different mindsets and history.

      Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty June 6, 04:50

        Russians were being ruthlessly oppressed by the tzars, then Uncle Joe eventually took over and made tzarist Russia look like a walk in the park, and now they have a former KGB officer with a predilection for poisoning his enemies. No wonder Russians are used to being told to shut up and take it. Even at it’s worst, English rule was never quite that bad.

        Reply to this comment
  3. Bill June 5, 13:44

    The leftist antifa have already started the violence along with other leftist groups. Look at recent events in California and Oregon. Look at the causes of the Spanish Civil War, constant attacks on conservatives and their vslues, and you will find similarities of what caused that and the actions of today’s leftists and so-called Progressives.

    Reply to this comment
  4. Rass June 5, 14:18

    It has started..just look at Portland..or all of California for that matter..it’s a matter of who will win… leftist hippies living in thier parents basement or the republican just back from Afghanistan…I’m going to say the right will win.

    Reply to this comment
  5. Spike June 5, 14:44

    In the end the Right will lose. The Govt. will declare Martial Law and confiscate weapons in a civil war. The Govt, who are Leftist Establishment, will prevail and no longer have to fear the armed public which is their end goal. Socialism will then rapidly follow.

    Reply to this comment
    • Wolverine June 5, 17:38

      Spike, whom will confiscate the weapons ? The Police ? Don’t think so, to many of them are on our side, The Military ? Don’t think so, too many of them are on our side too, and too many retired are gun owners themselves. So who does that leave, the Politicians, LMAO !!!

      Reply to this comment
      • Spike June 5, 18:31

        I hope your right!

        Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty June 6, 05:09

        Gee, Wolverine, we’re already in the beginning stages of government restrictions on weapons. It won’t come all at once – just little by little – and it will seem perfectly reasonable at the time. I predict that it’ll take about 5-10 years unless there’s some sort of “crisis” that speeds things up.

        Reply to this comment
    • Proudly Deplorable June 5, 18:47

      I think you are absolutely correct Spike. The Globalists own education, media, entertainment, politicians and the money..WE may or may not put up a fight but in the end the Globalist will win because WE are letting it happen.

      Reply to this comment
  6. 01 Mom June 5, 14:54

    I appreciate the logic and presentation of both sides.

    Reply to this comment
  7. jbm June 5, 14:57

    Which is why there is such an urgent need for awakened Americans,and I mean REALLY awake, to join in with the team at http://www.TacticalCivics.com and do as our Honorable ancestors did. Only stood at defense, not firing first, and, in humility, protected the free and bonded! Come see before you start casting stones folks…

    Reply to this comment
  8. Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 15:10

    All I can say is that conservatives on all conservative web sites post messages with a true desire for internal US conflict and war.

    Conservatives want US civil war.

    It seems like conservatives truly want to kill lefties, democrats and liberals so only ONE THOUGHT exists in the US.

    ONE thought = conservative = no gun laws etc.

    Socialism will be dead but we will have a Emperor in its place.

    Reply to this comment
    • Proudly Deplorable June 5, 18:52

      You can’t even imagine how far off you are.. You are being fed pure BS. All Conservatives want is to be left alone. You live your life and I will live my life. I am ok as long as you quit ramming your politics down my throat. Liberals on the other hand believe they have the right and responsibility to tell everyone else how to live.

      Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty June 6, 05:50

      I’m conservative, and I don’t want to kill anyone unless my life or the lives of my loved ones are in jeopardy. Taking a life kills not only the victim but also the perpetrator.

      Reply to this comment
      • Armin June 6, 19:40

        Well said, Miss Kitty. Every life is precious and killing another human being goes against everything we believe in. I have heard that when one kills another the perp becomes a little less than human. Something very precious is lost that can never be regained. I will kill if I absolutely have to, to protect myself and the ones I love but it will be an act utterly devoid of joy or happiness. And it’s something I will have to live with the rest of my life. And I know even now, it will weigh VERY heavily on me. No matter that I did it for the greater good. Only the psychotic or the truly evil enjoy killing. I am neither.

        Reply to this comment
  9. Red pill popper June 5, 15:16

    Too simplistic. A plebeian overview. No account of the string pullers and change of political money flow. Virtually
    no depth to the article, but (I guess) not a complete blathering blatherskite.

    Reply to this comment
  10. Prepper In Training June 5, 16:01

    No matter who wins, we ALL lose. Once the “war” is over, new laws will be written to ensure that something like this never happens again. The politicians that write those laws will invariably screw up as usual. They will be so concerned with this right, or that freedom, that the written law will be perceived to be unfair and we will be right back where we are today.

    Right or Left, you cannot fight for change if you can’t dictate what that change will be. The people in control, (Soros, Pelosi, Bush, Clinton, Trump, Deep State, MSM, etc..) are the only true winners. And, yes, I included Trump in that list, not because he is against America and Conservative values, but because he is as much in control of our current state as others in our government. No one wants a war, but, when you are in a position to benefit from whatever outcome, you will not stop the events leading up to it.

    Depending on which puppet master is in charge, a limited war will not produce the desired outcome. If the war is localized, there is no guarantee that “proper change” can be realized. If the war is national, then only international players will truly benefit. If the war is global, then watch out for the ultimate leader, for that person is the one I fear the most.

    As a prepper, I will protect me and my family/friend circle, but I will not rush to fight someone else’ war. My strings are pulled enough by people I know and the circumstances I am surrounded by; I don’t need/want them pulled by someone telling me what I should believe in.

    I know there are people in our nation that are preparing, not to survive, but to partake in the ensuing battles. My attitude is to let the idiots (right, left, and center) take themselves out. Those that survive will either be the strongest fanatics, or the most level headed. If they are fanatics, there will be much fewer idiots to contend with. If they are level headed, then those of us desiring to survive will still be strong enough to implement the changes that will be best for all.

    As the song says: You may be right, I may be crazy, but it just may be a lunatic you’re looking for…

    In this world though, you have to be a little crazy to survive the BS.

    Reply to this comment
  11. Miss Kitty June 5, 16:51

    Prophecy News Watch has a VERY interesting article about the fact that DHS is initiating surveillance of social media sites and collecting information about people who blog, post, and otherwise write about various issues. Read it yourselves, but it’s creepy!

    Reply to this comment
    • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 17:20

      What is DHS? I always knew that acronym as my high school in the 1970s. Deerfield High School.

      Reply to this comment
      • Armin June 5, 19:00

        Department of Homeland Security. Hope that helps. 🙂

        Reply to this comment
      • left coast chuck June 5, 20:10

        My goodness, I would think it would be difficult to find someone in this country who didn’t know what DHS stands for. I wonder what country you have been residing in since 2001.

        Even Armin who resides in Canada needed to enlighten you. Not to denigrate Canadian residents as belonging to some illiterate backwater country that certainly is not my intent, but he has no compelling reason to follow the political news from the U.S. — other than it is the highly populated, scary neighbor to the south that might overrun his country with armed masses if things go really bad down here, but why worry?

        If you are so uninformed as to not know the initials of the biggest, most influential department in the U.S. government, even bigger and affecting our daily lives more than the armed forces of this country, how do you feel competent to comment on other political questions?

        DHS has been in the news more than even The Donald. If you are a resident of the U.S. I can only assume you have spent the last 17 years in the far reaches of Alaska or some remote island in the Hawaiian chain. You certainly cannot have been residing in some populated area.

        Is there a chance you were recently released from a rendering that happened soon after 9/11?

        I gather from your comment about the Russian revolution that you number among folks like John Reed and other deluded intelligentsia who even when faced with the horrors communism inflicted the long-suffering Russian people continued to follow the communist line. Lenin and his subsequent replacements made the Romanovs look like benign, folk-loving, paternalistic pansies.

        Reply to this comment
        • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 20:23

          You still did not answer my question. What do donthink DHS stands for ? Why cannot you be clear instead of condescending?

          What does DHS stand for to you!

          To me it stands for my high school years ago. DHS = Deerfield High School.

          Reply to this comment
          • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 01:10

            J&JR, perhaps you should read your question… “What is DHS?”, now “What does DHS stand for to you!”
            ….Which one’s the question???

            Reply to this comment
          • Miss Kitty June 6, 03:59

            Ask your supervisor to get you a good American slang dictionary, or a connection to Google. You DO get Google in Russia, don’t you?

            Reply to this comment
          • Miss Kitty June 6, 04:18

            J&J, as you have seen, Americans are clearly divided over this ( and other) issues. But when push comes to shove nothing will pull us together quicker than having a common enemy because at heart we are a big (dysfunctional, true) family. We might squabble and bicker amongst ourselves, but NOBODY from outside best say ANYTHING about MY people or try to mess with them! Or we’ll open a can of whup-ass on them! Please feel free to pass that along to your “fearless leader.” Dos vidanya, pal.

            Reply to this comment
          • Miss Kitty June 6, 06:25

            If you went to high school in this country it was as an exchange student. Really, J&J! Stop fooling around. Your cover’s been blown, so just sit back and try to learn something.

            Reply to this comment
        • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 01:03

          LCC, I was wondering when you’d put your oar in the water 🙂

          Reply to this comment
      • bjay June 5, 21:30

        Department of Homeland Security

        Reply to this comment
    • Armin June 5, 19:16

      I think what’s closer to the truth, Miss Kitty, is that they’ve been doing this for quite a while and are just letting us know about it now. I’ve also thought that sites like this, run by people like Claude, are great places for governmental agencies to monitor. And I’ve also run across info that every bit of communication traffic, whether by phone or tweet or text or facebook or whatever is run through a number of huge systems that look for “trigger” words. All in the name of global security. If true they’re profiling all of us. These systems go by various names but they all do the same thing. They constantly monitor us. Not only creepy but highly disturbing. I don’t know if the information is true or not but I say it could be possible so err on the side of caution. But I don’t want to get into it too much on an open site like this. People will just think I’m some kind of a weird conspiracy nut and I don’t want that label.

      Reply to this comment
      • Jake TP June 5, 19:55

        Armin I personally have no doubt about these sites being monitored. Obama’s DOJ specifically named Patriots, Preppers and Christians as groups to be watched as potential terrorist groups.

        Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty June 6, 05:56

        So true, Armin. Oh well, since the “kitty” is already out of the bag…

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 6, 20:24

          Yup. Cat’s out of the bag, Miss Kitty. Claws and all. That particular feline will not be coaxed back in. I’m just not going to trade conspiracy theories with you. Not on an open forum, at least. LOL! Oh, wait! We’ll call them agendas. LOL! That’ll make it ALL better.

          Reply to this comment
      • Miss Kitty June 6, 06:17

        That’s ok Armin…I can make you a nice tin-foil hat like the one I’ve got. LOL

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 6, 20:17

          That’s cute, Miss Kitty. But I already have a full set. Thank you. One for rainy days. Another for sunny days. Cold weather. Hot weather. LOL! You have a really good sense of humour and you seem to be a very smart person. But on a serious note you would not believe the info I HAVE come across and much of it actually does sound plausible. But then you have to ask yourself, is it possible? And anything we can imagine is possible but is it probable? And does it make any sense? Some of it is obviously just pure hokum. I’m sure that anything that a human being can think of or imagine DOES already exist SOMEWHERE in this huge universe we’re in. Maybe even in our own galaxy. Just not yet on THIS planet. Do you doubt that it’s possible that there could be civilizations out there, SOMEWHERE, that are maybe even millions of years old and have technology that would be nothing but magic to us? I believe very little that they tell us on this world especially through the so-called main stream media. More so if it’s politically connected. They’re all shysters and because of the nature of the beast interested in their own self betterment more than anything else. Just as a little side note, Chuck mentioned that we really aren’t some backwater third world country. And obviously we aren’t. We just have too few people for the amount of land in Canada. We need something like the population of the United States for this country to grow properly. We have one tenth the population of the US and a country bigger than the US with such a relatively small population trying to manage such a large country. There used to be a joke going around many years ago that many Americans still thought we lived in igloos and hunted caribou and moose for food. I HOPE nobody believes that anymore if indeed they even did believe it at one point. Canada is a pretty good country and I’m glad I ended up here. But what we need in Canada are more people with the American entrepreneurial spirit. Sometimes Canadians are a little too laid back. We have a great country but what we need are the right people to make it grow properly.

          Reply to this comment
  12. Surly Curmudgen June 5, 17:24

    The left started an insurrection a long time ago. the right will eventually have to finish it and clean up the mess the left has and will have made.

    Reply to this comment
  13. left coast chuck June 5, 17:39

    Well,Claude, if you wanted to stir up a discussion, this is a topic sure to do it.

    Does anybody remember the summer of ’65? Does the term “Watts Riots” ring any bells?

    Concurrent with the rioting in the Watts region of Los Angeles, riots broke out in several other cities. At this late date, without doing some on line research only the names Baltimore and Detroit come immediately to mind.

    I was in a position to watch the folks who claimed to have a finger on the pulse of the nation and there was serious concern that the whole country would erupt in civil disorder. In addition to social problems at home, we were deeply involved in an unpopular military adventure in southeast Asia and there was wide-spread disenchantment with the falsehoods that were being disseminated by both the media and government officials about that conflict.

    As with today there were many violently disruptive groups. We had the Weathermen, the Black Panthers and the Symbionese Liberation group just to name three that come immediately to mind. There were more but again, I am talking about a time when many of the readers on this list were in grade school or perhaps not even born yet, so without research I can’t list all the little groups advocating and actually perpetrating violence.

    Are these times significantly different?

    I don’t think so.

    As distressful as they are with the giant rift between the extreme right and the extreme left, I think the giant center will ultimately prevail. The folks who are too busy getting on with their lives, contributing to the country as opposed to tearing it down. Those are the ones who will finally restore some semblance of balance.

    If you were not an adult during the summer of ’65, you cannot comprehend how divided the country was. Once again, more fifty years later we are close to being back to the divide that existed then and I believe that once again, the folks who are actually contributing to the greatness of this country, the folks who are busy working and supporting Little League and BlueBirds and Scouts and going to church on Sunday and trying to lead a good life will once again get the great ship of this nation back on course.

    The only reason I have the leisure to post here and elsewhere is because I am retired now. During the 60s I was too busy working supporting my family and Little League and Boy Scouts and my wife was too busy with homemaking, being the family transportation agency for all the activities our kids were involved in to be demonstrating and attending rallies and what not.

    I was deeply against the southeast Asia follies. Thank God we didn’t elect Barry Goldwater. He would have sent Marines to Vietnam. He would have bombed Hanoi. He would have mined Haiphong harbor. He would have sent troops into Laos and Cambodia. He would have brought the war into North Vietnam. Johnson promised us that he would do none of those things if elected. He wasn’t going to send good ole American boys to die in some pissant little southeast Asian country. No siree Bob!

    As you can see, old wounds heal slowly. Some of us, while not so vocal at the time still feel deep resentment over the lies that were told by the media and the government. Whoa! Sounds like I am talking about today, doesn’t it?

    I’ll pick up my soapbox now and steal slowly off into the twilight.

    Reply to this comment
    • Jeansandjacketrequired June 5, 20:06

      Oh please… the Symbionese Liberation group? They were the idiots that grabbed Patty Hearst. They were the gang that couldn’t shoot straight.

      One of the first news stories I was aware of.

      The Symbionese Liberation group were barely terrorists. They were just a bunch of jacked up idiots.

      Reply to this comment
    • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 01:19

      LCC, I was eleven years old in ’65. I don’t have a clue what went on then. I just remember Goldwater, the name. Primarily because my dear old dad told this joke a time or two: “Why doesn’t JFK like orange juice? …because it reminds him of Goldwater!!!”
      I hope that’ll make you smile 🙂

      Reply to this comment
      • kerry keel June 6, 06:49

        Being the youngest of 5 kids, I had the influence of older brothers and sisters. I saw the destruction as carried on the news and did wonder why they were acting as they did. Then, and now, let them rebuild for themselves, at their expense, what they destroyed. It’s foolish to rampage and act like a spoiled child when you feel you don’t get your way.

        Reply to this comment
    • kerry keel June 6, 06:48

      Why move off into the twilight. I agree with you. ’65, yes, I remember those events. I was not an adult, in fact, I was 13, then. The cause, at least in part for those events was similar to what we have now, people demanding what they feel they should have, but not have to earn it, like everyone else does. Personally, if a group burns down, or in some other way destroys homes or businesses, they should be the ones to replace what was destroyed. If it is their neighborhood, then they get to rebuild it, by their own blood, sweat and maybe even tears. Their expense, the government stays out of it. They did it, they can replace it. Even more so if they have attacked some other neighborhood. I think a policy like this would make people thing twice about how violent they wish to be. The positive side of that would be the experience they would gain for employment.

      Reply to this comment
    • Dupin June 6, 16:04

      As you noted, there was a lot of unrest back in the 60s with a fair amount of rioting, though nothing that the government couldn’t quell. In many ways, we seem to repeating the 50s and 60, though a bit more compressed. McCarthyism-like behavior seemed to be going on several years ago and now we’ve been back into another round of civil rights issues and demonstrations. We don’t have the full Cold War with the nuclear annihilation card going quite like it was, though North Korea can kinda stand in for that as well as some of Putin’s recent brags. All we need now is another unpopular war to finish it off. I remember the doom-n-gloom of that time with rapture only a few months off according to the Josh McDowells and Hal Lindsays of that time. The Second Coming still hasn’t happened (something about false prophets and a thief in the night), we survived the 60s and 70s, entered the “Mine, all mine” 80s and so on. Chances are that despite saber-rattling, puffed chests, lots of words from both sides and some rioting, we’ll make it through all of this as well. However, the fear-mongerers on both sides are working overtime to keep things stirred up (it makes money), as well as the Russian PsyOps groups putting stuff on social media also to make knees jerk on both sides.

      Just as a note, the Bluebird designation within Camp Fire went away in the 1980s. Brownies are still a part of Girl Scouts, and Cub Scouts are still a part of Scouting BSA.

      Reply to this comment
      • kerry keel June 7, 10:51

        Your reference to ” a thief in the night” is a reference to how the second coming of Jesus will appear. The allegory is this, a thief gives no warning that “you” are their target. You will not know until it happens. Ditto for the return of Jesus. If there is a rapture, as many people believe, there will be more chaos on this old rock than it has ever seen before. How will the sudden disappearance of thousands of people be explained, as well as every child that is not yet old enough to be accountable for their actions, that is, knowing right from wrong. Vehicle accidents, every where, aircraft crashing due to pilots not on board, and more situations than I could ever hope to name. As for Josh McDowell, all he did was point out that in his quest to disprove the Bible, he ended up proving the Bible to be accurate. Anything else he said about the second coming of Jesus was to point out that it would happen. Hal Lindsay was just putting forward a story line of what that event might look like. Neither of these men gave a date for that event. There is a difference between setting a date, which is forbidden, and telling people that the event is indeed coming. Yes, it is, examine Bible prophecy, versus our world conditions now, with an emphasis on Israel.

        Reply to this comment
        • Armin June 8, 00:03

          Your phrase, Kerry, “like a thief in the night” twigged something in the back of my mind and I had to look it up. In revelations 16:15 it’s in reference to the seven bowls of God’s wrath. In 1 Thessalonians, 5:1 it’s in reference to the return of the lord and the whole thing goes like this; “Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape”. Apparently the time will come when everything will appear to be going very well and that’s when we need to be on guard the most. At that point I’d like to be on my little patch of heaven. Away from all the major centres. With fishing pole in hand catching my next Muskie or Pickerel.

          Reply to this comment
          • kerry keel June 12, 06:16

            We simply will not know. There is cause to believe that His return is going to be when things are a lot worse than they are now, but not as bad as what is going to come there after. As for when, which is absolute speculation, but other major events that have happened to the church have followed other Jewish feasts, such as Pentecost, the time of harvest is the next big event. First fruits has come and gone. Remember, a day to God is as 1000 years. The harvest has been growing for the past “2 days”, and the time for harvest is coming. After that, will be the Feast of Tabernacles. It all gets very interesting, but the Jewish feasts do play a role as markers. Remember, Jesus was a Jew, so keeping their traditions is what He will do.

            Reply to this comment
  14. Mark Lad June 5, 17:42

    No one wins in an armed clash between Left and Right. Some survive,… but their world will always be a little darker and sadder. The best option I see is one where civil discourse can be accomplished in an open and forthright manner. The time for anger and rancor is well past us. We are a multi-cultured, multi-colored, philosophically divergent society whose great strength is rooted in that diversity. No ethnicity, color, race or religion has a patent on intelligence, political opinion, belief or any other characteristic. We are always better when we band together as AMERICANS than we are when we segregate into tribes by color, religion, political party or some other belief. As a people we need to find the common ground to unite under the flag and still realize that you or anyone else may or may not agree with a particular belief I hold. If we agree on a common purpose and hold that purpose, above our personal beliefs we can find the ground to work toward the greater good while still disagreeing on other issues. It is a matter of respect. If we all agree to respect one another and treat each other appropriately, then we can argue perspectives with honest emotion and passion. It is when we do not respect others that we trash their opinions and fall into discord.
    So I am beginning to prepare for the worst, a SHTF scenario, and hope that cooler minds, intellectual thinkers on both the left and right, patriots, who believe that those who fought for us and sacrificed, have a moral obligation to create an America for all its citizens, and adherents to the Constitution will be the voice that leads us away from trial to a better and more respectful and peaceful place.

    Reply to this comment
    • left coast chuck June 5, 19:21

      Hear! Hear! Well said, Mark. Mark’s voice is the voice of the large middle group that I hope will right the seemingly out of control course our nation is following and will once again become the glowing example among the nations of the world.

      Reply to this comment
    • Mature prepper June 6, 02:13

      Mark lad; diversity is not our strength, it is our DESTRUCTION,,as is P.C. TALK. Various people , the last 40 some years, have NOT assimilated. Are you a school teacher? LEFT.LIBERAL. TELL ALL OF THaT TO THE LEFT,,they do not want our constitution, islamists want to dominate & take over, hispanic Illegals want Azlan & 6 of our USA states, while raising Mexican flag. New black panthers , want America to be the new AFRICA, while asking for white genocide,like they did in Haiti. COME TO REALITY. WHAT BUBBLE DO YOU LIVE IN?

      Reply to this comment
  15. DaveM June 5, 17:47

    I personally am tired of the created BS that comes from the Left and liberals! I know one shoe has dropped….I wait for the second one! I am sure it will not be long

    Reply to this comment
  16. DaveM June 5, 17:51

    I know things will get hot very soon.. One shoe has fallen….when the other falls the liberals and democrates will hear it. They had better be prepared!

    Reply to this comment
  17. JohnBoanerges June 5, 18:18

    I believe that libturds will initiate conditions that cause general (Ve ne zu e la, Ven e zu, ela, Vene zuela, Venezuela, NO TOILET PAPER (or food) panic and hungry persons will flee cities. Maurading bands that make it this far will be targets IF they even get past my southerly neighbor (which I doubt). People like me will finish what those start.

    Reply to this comment
  18. Armin June 5, 18:35

    This is another one of those hot button type of issues that people are very passionate about and an extremely complex issue. And I don’t know enough about it to get into an intelligent discussion with someone over this. And I’m certainly not going to get into an argument about it. I don’t think it’ll be a matter of conservatives vs. liberals. I think it’ll just come down to people not being able to manage any more. None of us knows what the flash point will be if indeed there is going to be a flash point. It may not be so much a matter of who, as a matter of what. Personally I don’t think it will ever come down to a nuclear war. There’s just too much at stake and too much to lose and a situation like that can very easily get out of control. I think it’ll eventually come down to a condition of want and scarcity. More likely some kind of financial crisis which might make the great depression of the thirties look like a cakewalk. The American dollar (and please none of you take this personally..it’s not meant like that) is in a death spiral and not worth the paper it’s printed on. Most, if not all of the currencies in the world are fiat currencies right now and sooner or later there HAS to be some kind of correction. I just don’t know what form it will take. With that correction will come pain for us. They just might decide to devalue all of the world currencies at the same time and bring us back on a gold standard. And obviously if you have a lot of savings or investments you stand to lose a great deal if they decide to go that route. There are something like 3 or 4 people being born every second so the population is increasing at an alarming rate. The earth is a finite system and has finite resources. Sooner or later we will see a large spike in the price of just about everything including utilities that we all have to pay for. Every once in a while I have a craving for a really nice steak. But I’m not paying $30 or $40 dollars per pound for it. So I get the economy sized package of sausages instead. The time will come when people have nothing left to lose and then all heck will break loose. For myself, I’m at the age where I just might miss the worst of it. Just as an example, here in Canada, we have approximately 20 years worth (at the most) of known domestic natural gas reserves left in the ground. No one seems to be really worried about it. I ran across the info by accident and when I try and tell people they just shrug their shoulders and say, so what. Once we burn through (pun intended) the reserves we have, then we will have to import natural gas from somewhere and obviously the prices will spike sharply at that point. Then more people may have to decide between heat or food. At that point electrical heat may become the more desirable option but that will then put more of a strain on the electrical grid. In the heat of summer when everyone is running their air conditioners all day we’re just barely able to keep the lights on. The electrical grid is maxed out. Even now, with crude at something like $65 USD per barrel our fuel prices are hovering around $1.40 CAD per liter. PER LITRE! For goodness sakes. There’s no logic to it. And a liter is more or less the size of a quart. If I convert to dollars per gallon it comes out to approx. $6.35 CAD per gallon. Canadian gallon. Which is a little bigger than an American gallon. That’s just insane! And we have no choice but to eat that price. People need their cars for business and pleasure. And in the last few years house prices have risen to such a ridiculous degree so that now an ordinary house in Toronto is over a million dollars. Perhaps in part a true reflection of the value of a dollar? Putting it out of the reach of most new home buyers. Even where I live now (and it’s nowhere near a really big city like Toronto) the prices are STARTING at $600,000, $700,000, $800,000. Who the hell can afford to buy a house like that when up here we have to put 20% down on the house? Rental units aren’t much better. You’re lucky if you can find an apartment for under $1000/month. Ands then I don’t know of I’d want to live in that neighbourhood. More usual rents are $1200/1500 per month. You might as well be paying a mortgage IF you can get the down payment together. Even in the little dinky 1200 square foot house I’m lucky enough to be in (no debts) it went up almost $100,000 CAD in the last 4 years. I just about keeled over when I got the assessment. Obviously nice for me when the house keeps increasing in value. Not so nice when my taxes keep increasing. Right now I’m managing with the pension I’m getting but I’ve also had to make some hard choices. I’m not so optimistic about the future. I can see the time coming when push will come to shove and at that point people will have had enough and make emotional choices based on desperation and frustration. And then we’ll get more people being run down by vehicles and more home invasions and on and on. And with that will come an increased police presence with an increase in our taxes associated with an increase in manpower. I hate being this pessimistic but I do see a bleak future for the majority unless something REALLY amazing happens in the next few years. I hope I’m wrong.

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    • left coast chuck June 5, 19:53

      I don’t know if it was on this site or some place else, but I read something that went like this: In 1885 a gold dollar would buy you a suite, shirt and tie. In 19something, I think the date was 1965, the gold that was in the gold dollar would buy you an automobile but the paper dollar wouldn’t even buy you a tie.

      Today, the gold that was in the gold dollar will buy even more but the paper dollar not buy close to what it would have bought in 1965.

      Armin is absolutely correct that the U.S. dollar is worth about the paper it is printed on. The collapse of the economy when I think about it is scarier than an EMP, CME or global freezing. The politicos in Washington have kicked the can of debt down the road so many times and it is so battered and dented there is scarcely a can left to kick any more.

      I also agree with Marten. I think the entrenched bureaucracy is far more danger to our personal freedoms than any elected politician. I also think there is a whole subcategory called political appointees who are a danger to our freedoms. Look at the names that keep popping up as Ambassador to this country, Department head of that department, Secretary of this cabinet seat. This class of faceless names by virtue of the unaccountability actually wield more power in government than the elected politicians.

      Not to pick on just one individual, but John Bolton is back in a position of power again. How many times has this man held an unaccountable position of power in government? And when I say unaccountable, I mean unaccountable to the American people. He only has to yessir to one man, the president who appointed him. He and others like him have apparently gotten that art down to a fine point.

      The highly uncivil civil service is another danger. How many times do “civil servants” get fired for actual bad performance? How many times do they get fired for costing the taxpayers millions of dollars for either deliberate actions or just plain stupidity? They go on year after year wreaking havoc on the American people and never have to worry about being ousted. Even the ones that are vehemently anti-Trump, the worst case is he will be around for only eight years and then somebody new will be in and they won’t have to worry about ole Trumpet any more.

      Public employees control politics in this county. Between federal, state, county and the various individual unaccountable departments, mosquito abatement districts, water districts, harbor districts, fire suppression districts, the number of folks on the public payroll far outweigh folks who are providing the taxes to pay for all those public employees.

      I can tell you from experience in elections if the SEIU or the fire or police unions come out in favor of a candidate, he or she is in. The largest majority of public employees follow their recommendations in a mind numbing lockstep.

      I thought I had picked up my soap box but I see that I still need to pick it up and move on.

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      • Hoosier Homesteader June 6, 01:45

        In my humble opinion, the Trigger that will cause the collapse will be Climate Change. ….I know, I know, some say it’s all a bunch of BS. They may be right. I can’t stop thinking about the fact that the planet we live on has a finite number of resources. We’ve been plundering them since the dawn of the industrial revolution. We’re using up our water, the oil, natural gas, and the farmland. We can’t go on doing this. We can’t keep “fowling the nest without getting poop on our feathers.” When any one of these links in the chain breaks, that’s when the trouble will start. I’m not looking for a Civil War. At least not until after one of the links I mentioned fails and brings society to its knees.

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        • kerry keel June 6, 06:51

          Climate change and resource depletion are not the same thing. Researchers also point out that the sun’s energy output is lower. Low enough to cause cooler planet temperatures that could bring on some level of Ice Age. The dreaded green house gasses might just be saving us from having our crops fail due to weather to clod, and freezing some of our rear ends off.

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      • Armin June 6, 03:24

        You’re pretty well right about gold prices. More or less. 🙂 The current price of gold as of June 05, 2018 is $1,292.25 per ounce. Doesn’t buy you much these days anymore as these are 2018 dollars. Inflation is a wonderful thing. The Jan. 1965 price of gold was @283.54 per ounce and then it went down from there. You might be able to buy some kind of a car with it but not a very good one. Now if you had 10 oz. of gold in Jan. 1965 that would be a very different story. LOL! In Jan. 1980 gold prices spiked to $2183.06 and then plummeted all the way down to $368.84 in Apr. 2001. The latest I’ve heard about the American dollar is that if you take the dollar and assign it a value of 100 cents at the creation of the FED in 1913 the value of said dollar has now dropped to something like 10 cents compared to the 1913 dollar. Is it any wonder that now a good car costs as much as a house used to cost not that long ago? My parents paid $14,000 dollars for their first home in 1959. And that was a LOT back then. Everything was relative. It was a very nice house with a corner lot of almost quarter of an acre. It also had a guest house beside it that we called “the garage”. LOL! Huge chunk of land. Somewhere else I ranted about the current cost of housing and I’m not going to do it again. But I agree with you, Chuck, that the prospects of a financial crisis scare me more than any of the other “doomsday” scenarios. The situation can not continue like this indefinitely and somewhere a “correction” HAS to come. We’re living in a house of cards and sooner or later a light breeze will waft our way and destroy that house of cards. Those that haven’t planned for the future will be caught unawares and for these people the future might be quite grim. I think THEY have finally trapped themselves in a corner and no one has a good idea how to get out of it. I certainly don’t. Wish I did. Haven’t heard much about Venezuela lately. I believe THEIR financial crisis is still ongoing and the people still suffering horribly. That’s what happens when the government is short-sighted and puts all their commodity eggs in one basket. Many entities besides the FED have been engaged in “quantitative easing” (euphemism…a wonderful concept) which has only helped to lower the value of many of the world’s currencies. I’m surprised rampant hyperinflation hasn’t made it to the shores of the land of milk and honey yet. Give it time.

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        • left coast chuck June 6, 05:38

          I don’t know how much actual gold there was in a $1.00 gold piece. My mother had a $20 gold coin that was made into a necklace when the law proscribing the possession of gold in non jewelry form was passed. I understand many folks did that. The jeweler soldered a gold loop on the top of the $20.00 gold coin and a gold chain was attached. I have handled that piece in the past and I know there wasn’t 20 ounces of gold in it. Thinking about my post and the $20 gold coin, I wonder if the 19th century gold coinage reflected the actual gold content and by the 20th century our specie had been inflated to the point that it no longer actually represented the true value of the gold. The $20 gold coin was a little smaller than a dime. I must admit that I am completely clueless with regard to how the value gold coinage was set. The $20 piece was denoted as $20. If the price of gold fluctuated, then the coin would be worth more or less than its face value. Perhaps the value of the coin was set in its redeemable value regardless of how much real gold was in the piece.

          I probably shouldn’t have posted that post without checking to see if the values reflected were accurate. May be one of the urban legends that get around and pretty soon everyone believes they are gospel.

          However, the fact is that our money is backed by nothing of value except “The good faith of the government of the United States” and the fact is that the government has no control over how much money is printed, that is done at the direction of the Federal Reserve Bank, and all we have to do is look at how what we used to buy for a buck is now significantly higher. Take coffee for example. When I worked in a grocery store in 1959 coffee sold for 19¢ a pound on special. The regular price was 29¢ a pound. That was for a full 16 ounces of coffee, none of this 12 ounce can stuff. Same with 3 pounds of coffee. on sale at 39¢ for 3 pounds; regularly 49¢. You all know what you are paying for coffee today. And that “pound can” — look at the label, it more likely is 12 ounces.

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          • Armin June 6, 21:04

            That’s a really good question, Chuck, even though it’s waaaaaayyy off topic. But still interesting. I also don’t know how they set the price of gold and in this instance we’ll focus on gold specie. Apparently the first known gold coins were struck in Lydia, Asia Minor, around 600 BC. Don’t know what value they assigned to them. Or how. Biggest producer of gold these days is China. For the longest time the US gov’t set the value of the dollar at $20.67 to one troy oz. of gold. In 1934 the dollar was devalued to $35.00 per troy oz. In modern times the monetary system is known as the Gold Standard. Way too much info to put down here but if anyone is interested they CAN look it up themselves. Hope this at least helps a little.

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            • kerry keel June 7, 10:52

              At one time in this country, tobacco leaf was a type of currency. It just might come down to food, and other basic staples become a kind of currency.

              Reply to this comment
  19. Frank June 5, 18:45

    The blame for all this really sits on the preppy big eared, thoughtless, hopelessly idealistic and intellectually void, college boy Obama and a cast of fools that can not speak honestly or intelligently about the issues, but rather succumb to childish name calling and personal attacks on those who oppose them and their ideas.
    It may seem overly simplistic to blame one person or one group, but this how things have played out and we all witnessed Obama making speeches where he showed sympathy and support for young punks and such disdain for law enforcement that he practically accused them of being guilty.
    The lady who was critical of his lazy daughters was fired for saying what she did which is her right as per the right to freedom of speech. Just because she offended two girls who had hardly any involvement in anything, but yet enjoyed those expensive vacations and the great food and other benefits of being the President’s daughters. And she was not the only person to be fired unfairly and immediately while Obama was in office. It became a trend to see people with authority abusively and cruelly fire anyone that was not in agreement with the liberal, socialist regime.

    I am concerned about all these events where liberals are lashing out like schoolyard bullies and fear that at some point we will become “Us and “them” and retribution will be sought and then bloodshed will follow.

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  20. Ben June 5, 19:04

    The Left has already divided this Nation and they are still dividing us. The Right isn’t perfect, but at least they’re not determined to divide us at any and all cost.

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    • Jake TP June 5, 20:28

      Division is part of the game, a major part. This all started long before Obama but Obama can be remembered as the Great Divider. Division is why we have constant issues like Climate Change, Terrorists, Immigration, health care, LGBT, racism….etc. Division to create the up and coming revolt. The revolt paves the way for “Fundamental Change in America” (obama) which is Globalism.

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      • Armin June 6, 02:36

        I have to agree with you, Jake. And it is a game for the puppet masters with us as the expendable pawns. And it’s a game that has been playing for a long, long time. Ever since the time of Babylon. Nothing much has changed since then. Only our technology has gotten a little better. If you can still find it, and you may have to go to a website like http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/default.htm, there’s a really good book called “The Babylonian Woe”. Which explains a LOT! People forget that the end of the last ice age was only 10,000 years ago or so and before that we have no written history. There’s no way our civilization only began 10,000 tears ago on a planet that’s supposed to be 4.5 BILLION years old. Maybe our current civilization “restarted” then but there HAD to be other civilizations before this one. Apparently the Sumerians just “appeared” on the scene without any precursors. With their civilization at a very high level. How and why? The name of the game is divide and conquer. Keep us at each other’s throats so we don’t have the time to see behind the curtain. To see the illusion that is the great OZ. L. Frank Baum may have been on to something. Keep us reasonably fed and entertained so we don’t think about all the inequities in the world and how lucky we are to be living in the prosperity bubble of North America. Bread and circuses. Many people take our condition for granted. I take NOTHING for granted and am grateful every day for the abundance in my life as I KNOW life can change in an instant. It’s only people like preppers or others of the same mindset that actually do take the time to worry about the future and take positive steps to ensure SOME kind of future for the rest of us. We’re the ones that haven’t been completely hypnotized by modern society and that still have some small degree of mental acuity left. We’re the ones that ask the questions and that makes us dangerous. We aren’t satisfied with the stock answers. We refuse to toe the line. We want to know the how and why and we think ahead. And we try and prepare for the potential lean times. Our ancestors were smart enough to stock up in times of plenty. Not every year is going to have a bumper crop so our ancestors did their canning, their putting away, their planning for their future. Why should today be any different? Many think that things will always go on as they are. They may be surprised when the weather turns against us and wipes out most of a corn harvest or the major part of a wheat crop is destroyed by fire which happened in Russia not that long ago and wheat prices spiked sharply. We can’t prepare for everything but we can do our best to make sure that we have enough to eat and drink in whatever dark times may lay ahead of us and some way to defend that which we have so laboriously gathered together. I’m a pessimist (realist?) by nature and may be completely off the rails. Maybe a glorious and wonderful future lies ahead of us. There’s always the possibility of that one miracle that will change the path of the human race for the better. One can only hope. But as I have to live in the real world and see all that is happening around me I still live by; hope for the best but be prepared for the worst. And if the worst doesn’t happen then we have a little extra on hand to ride out the fluctuations of the market and be able to help those less fortunate than ourselves. 🙂

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        • Jake TP June 6, 15:09

          As a follow-up Armin, we all need to be aware and or reminded who the real enemy is. The real enemy is not the neighbor that votes for the other party. It’s not even the Mexican family down the street. The real enemy is the would-be rulers. The people at the top of the food chain that manipulate the thinking, action and votes of us here at the bottom. These are politicians, entertainers, pro athletes, owners of the media, the independently wealth who all believe they should dictate how WE all live. The Globalists. This international group of Elitists want nothing less that full control of life. The Elitists know exactly what they are doing and the science of how to get us to do what they want and we are ignorant enough to believe what we are told to believe. It is not a Left or Right issue, there are Globalist on both sides.
          The political and social issues are invented. They keep us busy arguing about climate change, womens rights, guns, insurance, borders, bakers that don’t want to make a cake for a gay couple, racism, entitlements, national security, etc. to keep us busy while they push the agenda forward. We are pawns, we are all useful idiots and it is time to wake-up and see the real enemy.
          I would be willing to bet real money that if asked the question, whether right or left, the vast majority would say, “All I want is to live my life my way and be left alone”. The Elitists however believe we are incapable of governing our own lives and believe we would be better off if our lives were strictly controlled. The fight should not be between the masses yet the masses are being used to do the fighting while the Elitists pull the strings.

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          • Armin June 6, 21:37

            You are spot on, Jake, and in this I have to agree with you completely. And I am so glad you have the courage to say this on an open forum. For the longest time I thought I was the only one that knew this kind of thing but it looks like people are starting to finally wake up and realize the truth. You are so right it’s frightening. And they exercise this degree of control over us because they’re afraid. They’re afraid that if we ever realize that there are many, many more of US than THEM and if we ever organize against THEM they are done for. They need us much more than we need them. Yes, we are the expendable pawns only because we let them assign that role to us. You say useful idiots. I’ve also heard the phrase useless eaters. All these divisions they’ve set up between us. They’re all artificial constructs designed to keep us in constant turmoil, at each other’s throats, justifying murdering each other for the sake of state-sponsored conflicts. Never allowing us to catch our breath. Never giving us the time to let us peek behind the curtain unless we expend a gargantuan effort to try and understand the machinations behind our so-called reality. No matter who we are or where we live, first and foremost we are ALL human beings wanting the same things. The basics in life. A little dignity. A little respect. A little love. The bastards at the top of the pyramid are the most evil and ruthless (people?) imaginable. Especially the ones at the very top. Like the Rothschilds. More like predatory reptiles than human. They care nothing for human life or suffering and they look at us as less than cattle. To be exploited. To be used as they see fit. To be manipulated as they choose. Many are happy in this contrived prison. I’m not. I have this splinter in my mind that won’t leave me alone. The burden that I bear is immense. I may eventually go down. But I won’t go down easy and I’ll take as many of those bastards with me as I can.

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            • Jake TP June 6, 22:31

              Thank you Armin. I sometimes hesitate to write such things and when I do I only hear from the ones that seem to enjoy hating each other. I admit that spewing hatred for the brainwashed left masses has a certain degree of satisfaction but they are the result not the cause. My greatest source of anger are the people that will not see or admit they are being manipulated.

              One of the things I hear that makes me crazy is when someone says that a politician “really cares about people”…
              This is a universal truth …. politicians care about votes, period. Politicians will do and say anything to get those votes.
              I am convinced that although we all my end up in a huge armed conflict we will only be thinning the herd for the Elitist. Until we eliminate the controllers at the top nothing will change.

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              • Armin June 7, 06:50

                I don’t want to beat this to death, Jake, especially on an open forum and I know that this is also way off topic but important I think and I’m of the same mindset as you. I am VERY hesitant to open these kinds of topics even with people that I know very well as most look at you askance and think you’ve gone completely off your rocker. To a lesser or greater degree we’ve all been conditioned or hypnotized/programmed (whatever you want to call it) and it’s very difficult to break out of that kind of ingrained programming. There are many in denial and can’t see the forest for the trees sort of thing. The example that I use, and it may be kind of goofy, is that if you don’t realize you’re in a prison then you have no desire to escape from that imprisonment. And we ARE in a prison without walls. Those few running this planet know very well how to control and contain and manipulate us.The digital era has made it very easy for them. Freedom is an illusion unless we’re free within ourselves and answer to one except ourselves. Difficult in this interconnected world. But the great awakening is under way and sooner or later people will say enough is enough as long as we can get law enforcement and the armed services on our side. To make the prison analogy a little more clear I’ll use this example. Imagine a million square mile nature reserve in Africa marked by very definite boundaries and enclosed by a fence to look like the natural landscape. This nature reserve has all kinds of animals wandering through it. Does the lion living in that reserve know that he’s actually imprisoned? I think not. To the lion everything seems perfectly normal and he lives out his life not knowing that he’s actually in a very large prison. Someone once said, can’t remember who right now, is that if the lie is big enough and told often enough that people will believe it because they can’t imagine something that big and having gone on that long to be a lie. I’m obviously paraphrasing but I’m sure you get the idea. And that’s all I’m going to say about this. There’s so much going on behind the scenes it’s ridiculous and trying to get to the truth is almost a full-time job.

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                • kerry keel June 7, 13:44

                  Armin, I believe you are right, we all do live in a very large prison. The ones who realize that and make the most noise about it are the ones picked off by the guards. The best thing to do, is to live in such a way as to minimize the effects of that imprisonment. In part, that means finding alternatives to the way things are supposed to work. An idea for that is, grow your own food, and put aside what you can for times of lack. Learn to produce what energy you can, for your own needs and show others that are interested how to do the same. The prison wants us to do as we are directed to do, to live as dictated to. There are those who see “preppers” as being a threat. They say that these people are, or might become, terrorists, because they have provisions that are outside of the norm, and which is controlled. People do not realize it, but if the delivery trucks stopped coming to the supermarket, the store only has 3 days of product on hand. The government can use that to control people in a crisis. Those of us who say no, as best we can to the prison, have our own means, and that makes us a threat to the keepers. To quote Teddy Roosevelt, “walk softly, but carry a big stick”. The “stick” comes in many forms, but is stil a means of defense that the keepers do not want people to have. Be as quiet as possible, draw as little attention as is possible, but do plan for the worst, as best that you can. FEMA tells us to have a 3 day supply on hand of food and other needs, so you went a little over board, if anyone says anything.

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            • kerry keel June 7, 10:52

              Armin, I agree. The big question is, how to organize to meet their threat, and reverse it. Getting others to listen and to see what is going on is a major concern, but with the effort made to do it, yes, it can be done. Do those of us who know, just talk about it, or make the effort to do it?

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          • kerry keel June 7, 10:52

            You are right. What we need to do, all of us, is to begin thinking for ourselves. Examine the situation and ask the question, is this actually what is going on, or is this a manipulation? Being a free thinker, having an independent mind is a good thing. Maybe the best thing we can do is to ignore the top level movers and shakers, and talk to each other to see what is really going on, and draw our own conclusions, as opposed to those that we are told to draw.

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            • Armin June 7, 23:14

              I really appreciate you replying to my rantings and ravings, Kerry. LOL! As far as I’m concerned you and people like you are right, on so many levels. The problem is how to find those people without tipping our hand and having someone like DHS come knocking on our door. If you don’t conform to the “norm” then you’re different. And if you’re different that makes you dangerous. A loose cannon. Someone that can’t be that easily controlled. Maybe that’s what people like us HAVE to do, Kerry. Live outside of the system. Most of us that come to visit and post on websites like this are pretty smart people that think outside the box. We are still free thinkers and our ranks seem to be growing. Probably like the people that were sent to Botany Bay by the British. Not really criminals, or else they would have been executed, but maybe more an inconvenience and embarrassment to the crown. Those that wouldn’t bend the knee. Those that couldn’t be cowed by authority. Most people MUST realize by now that we are kept in check by all those we have come to depend on. The people that provide our electricity, our water, natural gas or heating oil, our food. All very convenient for us and makes our life much easier but in some ways also constrains us. How many hours do most of us have to work to pay for that convenience? How many hours do we have to work for that car or those cars that sit in our driveway 90% of the time and rust? To provide all that for ourselves is very, very difficult and most don’t want to make the effort. Preparedness planners obviously think differently. Makes us a threat to the status quo. I’ve also heard the same thing about the grocery stores, Kerry. Only a very few days of food on hand. And if a real crisis did happen those stores would be emptied VERY quickly. Funny you should mention that quote from Roosevelt. I’ve been seriously considering getting an oak stave and starting to train with it. In the middle ages that’s all the ordinary person had. Bows and arrows. Staves. The Chinese took it a step further and made some pretty fearsome weapons out of ordinary implements. As for your “meager” food supplies, let NO ONE know. Only your wife and if possible the kids but make sure your kids understand the importance of keeping it under wraps. And obviously most of us just have a little extra on hand. I know for myself I just don’t have the money or the space to have large supplies tucked away. That second part is a really good question, Kerry, and it’s caused me many sleepless nights. Do we try and wake up as many people as we can with the danger being that one disgruntled person rats us out? Do we try and organize as a resistance movement would? Do we want to risk a civil war with the possibility that many good people might shed their blood for nothing and nothing would change? As much as I would like to bring this whole corrupt system crashing down, in practice the only way to do it would be to get to the people at the very top of the pyramid. And they are so well insulated from the rest of us it would almost be impossible to do. And then who would take their place? They’ve been at this game for a very, very long time, Kerry, and they’re very good at it. We can try and talk to the people we love and trust and try and wake them up and make them aware of how the world really works. Most people would dismiss us out of hand and label us certifiable. A good starting point is that book I mentioned to Jake. “The Babylonian Woe”. An eye opener, for sure. Food for thought. Food for a hungry soul. And the third part of your reply is very important. People need to start thinking for themselves and question everything and believe very little that comes across media outlets like CNN. Things like TV lull us into a sense of complacency and non thought. it’s actually been shown that TV has a certain hypnotizing effect on us. And in the digital age it’s very easy to overlay that TV signal with whatever messages they want our subconscious to pick up. Stores do it with the music they play. They overlay the music with barely audible messages not to steal that only our subconscious picks up. Sharpen and keep improving your faculties of critical thinking. Turn off all your electronics, INCLUDING THE TV, and just sit down with your friends and family and actually talk to them face to face. Do something with the family as a whole. Take a day and hike through a park. Together. See nature. Work in your garden. Do things together as a family. If it’s raining drag out the monopoly board. Play a game of cards like hearts. On a real board not on your electronics. Take one day a week and make it an electronics free day. As for organizing I think it can be done on a local level but organizing for the day that a real crisis may occur. For want of a better word preparedness planning but not organizing against authority. They’re just too well entrenched. And if you want to talk to your friends and neighbours about any potential threats that may arise in the future you have to do it very carefully and know those people very well. Events may be unfolding as they’re supposed to, Kerry. Maybe this is how it’s supposed to happen even if it breaks our heart that we can’t save everyone we love. There are always people that are a little more awake and others may call us paranoid, or crazy or whatever but for whatever reason we do try and plan for potential future disasters. This could be how nature makes sure the human race survives almost any major crisis. This could be how nature works and this could be how it’s SUPPOSED to be. I don’t want to give anyone any bad ideas or get anyone killed needlessly. I don’t think I’m THAT good a persuader anyways. And if we do try to organize our friends and neighbours for future threats how do we do it without them asking us the hard questions? If a giant tsunami is coming our way, do we stand and try and fight it or do we get out of the way? These are all tough questions we’ve all asked before. I would like to know the status of the resources that are on hand even in my own neighbourhood but how to broach the subject with those same people without raising suspicions? Who can we really trust these days with our lives, Kerry? This might be the way that we are compelled by force of circumstance to do it. Pick our spot where we want to stand and fight with others of like mind. And the way the universe might work is that people of like mind may end up in the same place. I really do want to meet some of you personally. I’ve come to greatly respect a lot of you. I know I’m not really helping, Kerry, just asking more questions instead of providing answers. I don’t have the answers. I wish I did. I’m an old geezer. LOL! Almost 70. I would love to live out the rest of my life in peace and contentment but there’s that damn splinter in my mind that won’t let me have any peace until I’ve accomplished certain things. And I already have picked out my spot where I want to make my stand. Now I just have to figure out a way to get there. I have a fair number of good friends and out of all of those I might know of 2 that I can talk with about things like this. The others would have me carted away in a strait jacket. If you do decide to try and talk to others about these matters, Kerry, obviously you have to decide who you can really trust. Be careful in all you say and do. I’m even leery about saying this much on an open forum like this. You never know who’s listening. I’m not too worried though. An old geezer like me isn’t much of a threat anymore. Especially to the entrenched power structure. I know where I want to end up, Kerry, and I’m doing all I can to get there even though it might mean leaving all I know and love behind. But my true friends will always be welcome there. Talking like this with someone like you has helped a lot, Kerry, and I’m very grateful for the opportunity. Thank you.

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              • kerry keel June 12, 06:16

                Armin, on the subject of energy, yes, there is solar power, but there is more to that. Graphene is being put to use as well. It allows for see through, albeit dimly, solar cells that convert not just visible light to electricity, but heat as well. For wind, we generally think of big wind mills. Let’s get that closer to mama earth, and use Savonius turbines. The “sails” for this can be a 55 gallon drum cut in 2 pieces, length wise. Need a generator, get the biggest vehicle alternator you can find. These beasts are capable of the same wattage as a 115 volt AC outlet, about 1800 watts. That is going to be 13 or so DC volts at 150 amps or so. DC to AC converters, these are very much improved. The stepped square wave used now will be seen by the electronic stuff as though it were good old, common AC volts. Long gone are the 60 cycle square wave converters that produced the whine that made them useless for audio and video equipment. For DC work, the bigger the bus bar, within reason, the better. The point there is as low a resistance as possible. If you can get enough silver for the wires, all the better. Silver is the metal used by which the resistance of other metals is compared. One last item, a new comer to the world of emergency power. It has been around for years, but we did not know of it. This is the Thermo-electric generator. It looks like the devices used for thermo-electric coolers, but it works differently. The device is known as a TEG. Heat one side, keep the other side cooler and you get a DC voltage out. These are now available in devices to be used for heating your coffee, or cooking your food. Output is not that great, but, the devices are available for higher output and support of larger devices. By the way, don’t forget refrigerators. RV refrigerators just need a heat source to make the refrigerant cycle.

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  21. Art June 5, 20:12

    It will not be the right or the left as we know them today. It will be illegal immigrants from Mexico, South America, and Muslims. We have no borders. Everything is open to these invaders who take and give nothing. They come with nothing to add value to this country. These come with the intent of taking over by outnumbering American citizens. The Muslims come to take over. They breed like rats with the intent of taking over the government. The war has started and legal citizens have their heads in the sand.

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  22. PB- dave June 5, 21:39

    Liberals are just vehicles and tools for the use of the powerful string-pullers and puppet masters. Sadly everyone is a “victim” in their ilk., and demand their fair share of everything even if they don’t contribute.
    Their chaos is staged with bussed-in hired protests designed to do nothing but drowned out any opposition dialog. ….. one post said ” can’t we all just get along….” That will never be allowed to happen examples: “tea party rallies” those started out as a NON-partisan attack on the swamp, flooding congressional offices with tea bags to protest taxes, spending, and failure to represent working Americans. Those rallies brought together Dems, GOP, business people, and wage earners….. the powers that be were put on notice and SCARED, their answer was to label is as extreme alt right evil conservative, plot to attack the Democratic poor….. the latest example is the Trump election, nobody wanted Trump but he was the closest thing to a reset button for the country, and you can see the effort to stop him. Hate to say it, but a good size solar event would be a hell of a reset for planet earth, anyone for a do-over ?

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    • IvyMike June 6, 00:40

      You’re Going To Need A Bigger Boat should’ve been the title of Giurgi C’s original post, talk about pouring blood in the water to stimulate the sharks…I remember the (mostly) race riots of the 60’s. The government put them down with tanks and infantry. In America, when things are going well, our freedom is at its greatest. Problems start, the Government starts taking freedom away. Like Reagan suspending everybody’s 4th Amendment rights within 60 miles of the border or a port of entry, or in an arbitrarily declared high intensity drug trafficking zone. Or the antics of the TSA. The explosive growth of the security state with W’s Patriot Act, or Obama’s quiet targeting of American citizens for extra-judicial death by drone.
      Most people know about the CCC during the depression, what is less known is that the reason behind it was to get idle young men out of the cities and beyond the reach of Communists and Anarchists who might organize them into a revolutionary force.
      I’m not left or right, just leave me the eff alone, but I applaud Antifa for attacking white supremacists. A few Antifa in 1930s Germany might have kept Hitler locked in a damp basement with his oil paints, insanity and all his fellow cockroaches and other fascists.
      Saying the Left has the support of the unions and is a real threat is funny, we’re talking AFSCME and the teacher’s unions here, boy that scares the h-e-double hockey sticks out of me.,,
      Our Constitution gives our Government the right to put it’s boot on our throats if we get out of hand, and it will not be shy about doing it, just check out the Wikipedia list of US massacres.

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      • kerry keel June 6, 06:49

        White supremacist, is that what those who are called that really what they are? Maybe that is just a tag a trouble maker put on someone, or a group of people because the trouble maker needed an excuse to cause trouble. Anyone trying to get a group of people to “riot”, or cause trouble needs to be questioned, closely, for what they really are trying to do, and for what reason. How will those they get angry are going to be better for their actions? Are those actions really worth the trouble? Everyone has an opinion, but only if someone agrees with that opinion, does the opinion have any value. For this white supremacist thing, even if someone says they are, and all others are less than they are, it is their opinion. Best answer for them is to walk away.

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    • Armin June 6, 02:42

      I’m all for a do-over, PB-Dave, but the downside to something like that may be that we would lose a lot of GOOD people. Maybe even some that you love and hold near and dear to your heart. A new broom would sweep clean but at what cost?

      Reply to this comment
    • kerry keel June 6, 06:50

      A massive, “cntrl-alt-del” for this old rock might be a very good thing. Drop the population to a few thousand, and hit restart. For some, that is what the book of Revelation in the Bible is all about. The end there is, God rules all, and anyone who decides to rebel is gone, instantly, forever.

      Reply to this comment
  23. Susan June 6, 02:28

    I think it will be a giant traffic jam, with gridlock and road rage affecting all equally.

    Reply to this comment
  24. Domeliving June 6, 02:40

    Fact check (just to make sure nobody misses the tongue in cheek nature of the comment) for summer of 65 ( and the next several years), actions of Johnson and our government/ military, bombed Hanoi-check, mine Haiphong harbor-check, sent troops into Cambodia-check, send good ole American boys to die – check there is a few more than 58000 names etched in black granite. Also, if someone referred to LBJ and meant the commander in chief they had to say so, otherwise it would be taken as Long Bin Jail. Usually as part of “What are you going to do shave my head and put me on line? Just send me to f__cking LBJ.”

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  25. Nobody June 6, 12:27

    just a bunch of bull shit. this talk….. we say all this crap, but when it dose happen, then we will see. all lies. you will be a bunch of crying little tits.
    no one will be there to help each other in bad times. we don’t help each other know.
    this earth that we call home is going to POP one day. maybe sooner then later.

    better get ready for the bad shit to come and it won’t be here to help, it will come to destroy. just like it say’s. kill ,steal and destroy. just watch. it’s on it’s way right know. freedom is gone. we are slaves to all that they have. good luck out there when it comes to you’re door and it will come……..




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    • Wannabe June 6, 15:33

      The reason why the flag looks backwards is because it symbolizes running to the fight and not retreating. You know like in the old days when flags were carried onto the battle field and you run to the fight and the flag is facing the opposite direction because the momentum was causing drag which caused the flag to blow behind them and appeared the flag was backwards? Thought you might need that history lesson.

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      • NOBODY June 7, 12:25









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    • Armin June 7, 06:10

      @Nobody No one knows how it’s eventually going to go down if indeed there IS going to be a major crisis at some future date. No one can predict how or when or what is going to happen. Apophis is supposed to come whizzing by us somewhere in early 2029. It’s over 1000 feet in diameter. That’s one big chunk of rock to come whizzing by us at something like 30k mph. I once took the time to figure out the approximate weight of it and you would be surprised how much it weighs. It is one heavy mother frogger for its size. 1000 feet in diameter is a RELATIVELY small asteroid. Our scientists say it’s supposed to miss us. They could be wrong. Maybe that asteroid will be the trigger that sets off the catastrophe that we’re planning for. But it’s not something I can worry about or do anything about. I’m just using that as an example. I think you’re wrong about people, Nobody. I have seen for myself that people DO come together in a crisis for a common cause. I think it’s just our natural instincts to help others. Of course in any major crisis there will always be the opportunists. The looters. The thieves. The crooks. But those kinds of people won’t last long in either a continent-wide crisis or a world-wide crisis. In a very short time they will become the outcasts and the pariahs of society never mind movies like Mad Max or TV shows like the Walking Dead. The latter totally disgusts me and I think the reality would be quite different. I tried to watch one episode of the Walking Dead to see what all the hub-bub was about and it literally made me sick to my stomach and I’m not particularly squeamish. In that one episode one psychotic held others prisoner and ended up bashing them on the head with a baseball bat wrapped in barbed wire. Just giving people bad ideas. I couldn’t watch it all the way through. I had to turn it off. I recognize garbage when I see it. If we DON’T work together towards a common goal in a major crisis we might as well put a bullet through our own heads because then we won’t survive as a species. Can you do your own dentistry? Can you stand watch by yourself 24 hours per day? Can you do surgery on yourself, if needed? Can you do all the things that you need to survive in an end of the world situation if you’re on your own. I think not. People need people. And I dislike bringing out clichés all the time but no one person is an island. We go mad by ourselves. I still remember the scene in the Tom Hanks movie, Cast Away where he set up a volleyball to talk to. PEOPLE NEED PEOPLE and if you want to try and make it on your own in an EOTW situation, more power to you and I do sincerely wish you the best of luck. PEOPLE NEED PEOPLE and there is no getting away from that, sir.

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      • NOBODY June 7, 11:41




        GOOD LUCK, SIR

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        • Armin June 7, 21:02

          To Nobody: Now I can understand a little better why you think as you do. It seems as if you’ve seen the worst of us. It’s a sad indictment of the human race when people CAN help someone else and choose not to. I’ve seen both sides. I’ve seen the worst AND the best of people. I do my best to treat everyone I meet with respect and kindness and I get what I give. Most of the time. I have seen many, many random acts of kindness but unfortunately in a true extended grid down situation where everyone is literally desperately starving we may see the true nature of man burst forth. And I’m sure we’ll see both sides. Situations where men are more like animals than humans and also the opposite. Where some are able to rise above the situation and engage in heroic actions for the benefit of the whole. As I’ve said before, sir, I have no idea how it’s going to play out if indeed it does at all. But if it does happen we will have to make the best of a horrendous situation. And there will be those that take advantage and there will be those that act out of selflessness and great courage for the benefit of others. Bottom line is that I hope it never comes to pass because it will probably be worse than anything we can imagine. It was very kind of you and your wife to help that person when no one else would. That says much for you and your wife. You are good people with a good heart. I also wish you the same, sir. May life bring you and your wife all that you hope for. As for man leading us to hell, sometimes angels come down here to help us. Temporarily taking on human form to perform extraordinary acts. And if some people are determined to lead us down the path to perdition we don’t necessarily have to follow them, do we? We still have free will. I sincerely wish you and your wife all the best. God bless.

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          • NOBODY June 8, 15:19

            TO Armin

            thank you for you’re kindness…

            I hope that if it dose go bad that we can get together and help others. you seem to have a good heart. thank you for that. I have done and helped many of people over my life time. almost lost my life helping some people. but it was the risk that I was willing to take to help others. we should be more helpful to all humans on the earth. but we do have to pick and choose, who we help. hope to talk with you some more about how we should help others. when the shif. I will be there to help all I can, but only some, others you can not help at all….

            NO DISRESPECT TO YOU….


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            • Armin June 8, 20:12

              To Mr. Nobody. Thank you very much for your kind words. I do try most of the time. Sometimes people tell me I’m very trying. LOL! Not always successful. Not perfect. I have my faults just like every one else. I think the best that most of us can hope for is just to try and do our best for ourselves and for others and acknowledge that we’re not perfect. I extend the hand of friendship to everyone. Sometimes it’s accepted, sometimes it’s swatted away. I treat everyone the same. With respect, kindness and civility unless they’re total a-holes. Then I just say good luck with that and walk away. Circumstance and titles don’t matter to me. I’ll treat the CEO of a company and a homeless person on the street the same. I respect the person, not the title. We’re all the same under the skin. I’ve met some CEO’s that were total jerks and I’ve also met some people living on the street that were amazing, erudite, well-spoken and very kind. As to the latter I think that but for the grace of God there go I. And I’m grateful for all that I have and who I am and give thanks every day for the riches in my life. I take NOTHING for granted. In some ways I’m the richest person on the planet, I just don’t have a lot of money yet. LOL! But riches come in many other forms than just money which is obviously a totally artificial construct but that is how the present system is set up and if we want to survive we have to work within that same system. A pleasure communicating with you, sir. Again, all the very best to you and yours.

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            • kerry keel June 12, 06:18

              Armin, if you are interested in a more direct contact with me, then that kind of information can be found at qrz.com. You’ll have to join the site to get that kind of information. Use the following for better contact, that piece of information being, my call sign. wa2qcj is what you need. Yes, I am a HAM. Electronics technology is hobby, and the basis of how I make my living.
              I’ll agree, helping others some times requires risk, and some times you just don’t feel that you should. Other times, you just know that helping out is what has to be done. One of my favorite subjects is water. I encourage all to get a reverse osmosis filter system for their home. The kind that will at least supply the kitchen is a good choice. Even well water can be contaminated and people not realize it. The basic filters, such as those that fit on a faucet, or the inline things for the refrigerator, for the most part, they are of little value. They are designed for good quality water. The best their users get is taste improvement, and some sediment removal. Beyond that, they are useless. I know, I have studied this. Reverse osmosis, if whatever it is that is going to come into contact with the filter is much larger than the water molecule, it is not getting through the membrane. Very few contaminates, based on a report I have, there are maybe 3 such contaminates that can get through, can get past the RO membrane. Those 3 have little affect on a person’s health, and may not be present at all. Reverse Osmosis is the top filter to have. Next in line is the Life Straw, and the Sawyer filters. I am well acquainted with their filter media. Properly used, they make great filters as well. For those who may feel steam distillation is a good deal, there are contaminates that can boil of with the water and re-condense in the water. Steam distillation has merit, but the distillation should operate in a vacuum such that the expected gaseous, or low vapor pressure contaminates boil off first, leaving the water not yet hot enough to turn to steam.

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  26. Ric June 6, 14:33

    It’s plain to see the liberals have already started the unrest. Conservatives are hoping for an amicable settlement, if you will, but don’t confuse “hoping for” anything from Conservatives as a weakness.

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  27. Emanon June 6, 16:47

    I will say my piece and leave it there.

    Flash mobs of the left are numerous and potentially dangerous. That said, however, vast majority of them are just scared or pissed at how things are going. If the tables were reversed, the right would be in the same state, except generally better armed.

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  28. Midwest Transplant June 8, 11:43

    To all.Does anybody remember the TV show (Max Headroom)?didn’t last but a half a season,I think it hit to close to home.

    Reply to this comment
    • Armin June 8, 19:44

      I half remember it, Midwest, butt I was too young to appreciate it at the time. Something about a dystopian near future dominated by television and large corporations. Sound familiar? If anyone doubts that the large corporations and the banks are able to exert much more control than they should are still living under a rock. Again and again, Midwest, I say bread and circuses. Keep your population entertained and reasonably fed and most will be quite tractable. Matt Frewer was the voice of Max Headroom. As an interesting little anecdote the character’s name came from the last thing crusading journalist Edison Carter saw during a car accident that put him into a coma: a traffic warning sign marked “MAX. HEADROOM: 2.3 M”. I remember Matt Frewer in some kind of other show playing opposite a black man. Some comedy and they were talking about the other man’s kids and debating class. And Frewer comes out with the comment something like that one of the kids will eventually end up being the “master debater”. I cracked up laughing over that. Shoulda seen the look the other guy gave Frewer. Priceless. LOL!

      Reply to this comment
  29. kdog June 10, 03:52

    Which side threatens and kills Nurses and Doctors? It is not the left who uses violence to inforce its moral beliefs.

    Reply to this comment
    • Miss Kitty June 10, 11:40

      Please be more specific. Exactly to what incidents are you referring? Please include dates, location, all persons involved in the alleged incidents and any specifics you can provide. Thank you.

      Reply to this comment
      • kerry keel June 12, 06:19

        To what are you referring to, and specifically to whom? Be as specific to what you are making reference to as you demand of others. This back and forth message system leaves room for error since it is not a flow of information from one posting to the next. Your request is confusing. You may know what you are talking about, but I certainly do not, and I am sure others feel the same way. You, put in details you want answered, for the sake of continuity rather than to the all to common position of a lot of women where the person they are addressing is supposed to know what is being talked about, when the person being questioned, or assaulted, has not a clue.

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    • kerry keel June 12, 06:19

      First of all, what is the “inforce” word? My spell checker underlines it as a “non-word”, or a misspelled word. Did you mean, perhaps, “enforce”? Anyway, both sides are equal in the blame for taking out doctors and nurses. While your point of view may be skewed in one direction, in truth, both sides are guilty. The biggest issue for this is the point of view of whomever is doing the evil deed, or someone acting under the guidance of big Pharma to take out a possible threat.

      Reply to this comment
  30. Double D August 14, 22:07

    Forget about left and right, and lets re establish the constitution, the bill of rights, and get money, corruption and Corporations out of politics.
    The rest of the solutions may end up being one way or another, or some type of compromise. We also need to bring back anti trust and limit the acceptable size of banking and media. This used to be the case by law, but now the fox is in charge of the hen house, and we are all at risk.

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  31. fuzzzy1949 December 20, 04:25

    We already have the answer to that question in the form of antifa in Portland and elsewhere in our nation. Liberals should not be called “socialist” but by their real nomenclature Communist! This can be proven by a little look back in history at the former USSR. Then look at the very first thing a “socialist?” does when they take over a country. It gets worse the further you dig in history and it happens in every case. When you have found this information compare that to current day United States government actions.

    Reply to this comment
  32. dz December 20, 05:39

    to put this in simple terms so that even the totally indoctrinated sheeple created by a liberalized public education system, which leaves them with a permanent ignorance and aversion to truth and reality, all you have to do is some honest research and see what our current politicians are doing, and involved in, including questionable and even illegal activities. This farce the Democrats have been propagating for years of trying to gain total control over all aspects of government and the populace has got to be stopped – get out and Vote!

    for the question of who will start civil unrest? again, just look at ANTIFA, which is a name specifically chosen to deceive, because they are the most Fascist leftist group currently in the US, and sadly the liberal local politicians where ANTIFA has been operating have ordered law enforcement to stand back and watch while they blatantly harm others, destroy property, loot, and commit arson. The conservatives don’t want a civil war, but I’ll be damned if I’ll surrender to a bunch of spoiled ignorant socialists that want to “fundamentally change” America into a Socialist dictatorship. If you don’t like it here in the USA then don’t try to impose your BS doctrines on everyone else, permanently move to another country where you can fully experience the realities of Liberal Socialism and the corruption and dictatorships that result, may I suggest Venezuela, Cuba, Russia?

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  33. dz December 20, 05:48

    Nobody, I asked this myself when I saw Navy Seals with flag patches like this, and they said the flags on uniforms are now designed so the field of stars is toward the heart. If the flag patch is on the left shoulder the field is in the upper left so it’s closer to the heart, if the flag patch is on the right shoulder the field is on the upper right, again so it’s closer to the heart.

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  34. Wishful thinking December 23, 18:30

    I hesitate to comment most of the time because I don’t think I can change anyone’s baked-in opinions and really dislike the vitriol and nastiness that some people need to spew. I agree that the media tends to magnify the differences between us — outrage sells. The liberals I know are generally well meaning, generous people. They can annoy with their political correctness and thinking they know what’s best for everyone. However, the liberals I know want civility and for everyone to work together for common good. I’ve also seem conservative friends give, even when they have very little. But they also think they know what’s best and want to dictate to everyone with a sense of righteousness that scares me. As far as civil unrest is concerned, who do you think has the most guns and is most ready to use them? Do the Democratic candidates talk about civil unrest or is it the Republican president? There is blame on both sides, but if there is violence, it will occur on the extremes. The challenge is to not allow the extreme people become mainstream. Most Americans I have encountered in my lifetime are left or right of center, but decent people. We can’t allow the extremes to overtake our good sense.

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